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Guest Guest Curious

Much of the news media worldwide is owned by private individuals. The 90 year old ultra right wing Rupert Murdoch owns newspapers in the US, UK, Australia and perhaps elsewhere. He also owns Fox News in the USA and also increasingly found in other countries. So anything on Fox News and the Murdoch papers reflects the views of Murdoch. In other words, very right wing, very Trump, always biased and often untrue. The Straits Times is owned by SPH and it's reasonable to assume that Temasek has a degree of control. In Hong Kong, the main English language newspaper South China Morning Post is now owned by Jack Ma of Alibaba. You can draw your own conclusion over the direction that paper now takes.

 

As for the vdo about the War in Iraq, it was the politicians who fed the media most of its war mongering rhetoric. Most was pure lies. Many of the lies were fed to the US administration by a pissed off Iraqi ex-politician who hated Saddam named Chalabi. Even though Iraq had given up its weapons of mass destruction years before, that did not stop Bush's National Security Adviser Condoleeze Rice appearing on tv news programmes spouting with such sincerity about nuclear mushroom clouds if the US did nothing. She was lying. Bush and his right wing warmongers were desperate to get rid of Saddam Hussein. 

 

Not all news outlets put out lies and fake news. But it's not easy finding out which ones to trust.

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1 hour ago, Blow away said:


An eye opening video on how the US found reasons to invade Iraq. 
 

Do share other examples of how the west has created fake news.

 

Without any doubt, the media can publish news that are fake.

 

The owners of the media outlets are the ones deciding on what news to publish.  Who controls them?  Nobody!   It is only in the courts where victims of libel and slander can fight the fake news that harm them.  But what if the "victim" is a country, a race, an ethnic group?  Can they be the plaintiffs in a suit?

 

And in addition to the control and punishment of the sources of fake news...  who decides what news are fake?   Here come the "fact checkers",  like we can read in:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fact-checking

 

The reality is that fake news are and have been created forever all over the world.  It is not an exclusivity of THE WEST.   Russia, China, N. Korea, etc.  don't create fake news? The same of any totalitarian government,  East or West?  Of course, in the last four years of a disastrous administration, there has been a never surpassed super-spreader of fake news in America:  Donald Trump.  And in addition to him,  it is a fact that Republicans (the GOP party) is comfortable with the principle that "the goal justifies the means" and they don't mind spreading the most shameful lies and deceptions to attain their goals,  the perpetuation of the good life of the White rich and upper-middle classes in America.

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1 minute ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Without any doubt, the media can publish news that are fake.

 

The owners of the media outlets are the ones deciding on what news to publish.  Who controls them?  Nobody!   It is only in the courts where victims of libel and slander can fight the fake news that harm them.  But what if the "victim" is a country, a race, an ethnic group?  Can they be the plaintiffs in a suit?

 

And in addition to the control and punishment of the sources of fake news...  who decides what news are fake?   Here come the "fact checkers",  like we can read in:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fact-checking

 

The reality is that fake news are and have been created forever all over the world.  It is not an exclusivity of THE WEST.   Russia, China, N. Korea, etc.  don't create fake news? The same of any totalitarian government,  East or West?  Of course, in the last four years of a disastrous administration, there has been a never surpassed super-spreader of fake news in America:  Donald Trump.  And in addition to him,  it is a fact that Republicans (the GOP party) is comfortable with the principle that "the goal justifies the means" and they don't mind spreading the most shameful lies and deceptions to attain their goals,  the perpetuation of the good life of the White rich and upper-middle classes in America.

An undeniable fact is that the biggest fake English news producers are the US and UK.

 

As for fake news by China, the (un)fortunate thing is that most people outside of China don’t read Chinese so they are less exposed to Chinese fake news.

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https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/02/19/china-uighurs-genocide-us-pompeo-blinken/

 

State Department Lawyers Concluded Insufficient Evidence to Prove Genocide in China

 

The current joke is that the US hates China, they hate muslims but they love the muslims in China. 
 

Remember the first people that Trump banned from coming to the US were the muslims. 

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13 minutes ago, Blow away said:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/02/19/china-uighurs-genocide-us-pompeo-blinken/

 

State Department Lawyers Concluded Insufficient Evidence to Prove Genocide in China

 

The current joke is that the US hates China, they hate muslims but they love the muslims in China. 
 

Remember the first people that Trump banned from coming to the US were the muslims. 

 

This is very credible.  The surging malevolent supremacist groups encouraged by Trump don't limit themselves to slander Chinese,  they have also taken up Asians in general.  They blame Asians for the Covid pandemic. 

 

But... why don't they blame themselves???  They are the most recalcitrant anti-mask, anti safe distance people in the US,  and therefore are responsible for causing in America the biggest explosion of Covid-19.   Still today, a large fraction of the population is reluctant to get vaccinated.  These idiots are also to blame for the persistence of the pandemic, and maybe they are the same idiots who bunch together without masks, without any precautions. 

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14 minutes ago, Steve5380 said:

 

This is very credible.  The surging malevolent supremacist groups encouraged by Trump don't limit themselves to slander Chinese,  they have also taken up Asians in general.  They blame Asians for the Covid pandemic. 

 

But... why don't they blame themselves???  They are the most recalcitrant anti-mask, anti safe distance people in the US,  and therefore are responsible for causing in America the biggest explosion of Covid-19.   Still today, a large fraction of the population is reluctant to get vaccinated.  These idiots are also to blame for the persistence of the pandemic, and maybe they are the same idiots who bunch together without masks, without any precautions. 

What I find most amazing is that the US and its people thrive on the Cold War mindset. 
 

They need to have an adversary to defeat.

 

Just cos China is going to overtake them economically, so it is their worst enemy right now. 
 

Ever since they dropped the atomic bombs, they know they are capable of inflicting damages. And they never stop inflicting damages ever since then. Cos it’s their way of maintaining dominance. 
 

The world sans the US and its alliance actually welcomes a China that breaks the US hegemony. 

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I didn't know you liked China this much, Blow away.

 

But to get back to topic, yes, the West has made fake news before. 

 

It's not a phenomenon exclusive to the West though, as someone else has pointed out. There is not a single source of news out there that is truly, 100% unbiased. Doesn't matter what country, what organisation - there is always a slant. It's how close to the truth something is.

 

Having said this, while I would never disagree on the benefit of getting your news from multiple sources (if you are multilingual, even better), if I had to choose, I would be more inclined to trust Western media. When it comes to freedom and human rights, as far as I can tell it is the Western societies which have it better.

 

At least, when mistakes are made, people can talk about them. It has not been lost on me that the video you link is in English, a Western language. We can discuss, critique, debate about the American administration and its involvement in the Vietnam war, Iraq, etc. all we want on the internet. Would we be able to do the same for the Tiananmen Square incident on China's internet/media? I don't think so. 

 

Freedom does make things messy, yes. Just look at US media or Taiwanese media. But at least the truth is guaranteed an opportunity.

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1 minute ago, Guest Hmm said:

I didn't know you liked China this much, Blow away.

 

But to get back to topic, yes, the West has made fake news before. 

 

It's not a phenomenon exclusive to the West though, as someone else has pointed out. There is not a single source of news out there that is truly, 100% unbiased. Doesn't matter what country, what organisation - there is always a slant. It's how close to the truth something is.

 

Having said this, while I would never disagree on the benefit of getting your news from multiple sources (if you are multilingual, even better), if I had to choose, I would be more inclined to trust Western media. When it comes to freedom and human rights, as far as I can tell it is the Western societies which have it better.

 

At least, when mistakes are made, people can talk about them. It has not been lost on me that the video you link is in English, a Western language. We can discuss, critique, debate about the American administration and its involvement in the Vietnam war, Iraq, etc. all we want on the internet. Would we be able to do the same for the Tiananmen Square incident on China's internet/media? I don't think so. 

 

Freedom does make things messy, yes. Just look at US media or Taiwanese media. But at least the truth is guaranteed an opportunity.

I am not going to engage you on this at all as you have already decided what you want to see.


There is this psychology study that shows that people select what they see. In other words, they will start with their conclusion and then select things that fit their conclusion.

 

You started your post with the most biased statement. You stated that I like China this much. It’s very hard to take you seriously when you make things personal. 

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Guest sgman

The problem is that China is not exactly endearing itself to the world.

The Hong Kong issue.

The Taiwan issue.

Trade war with Australia, USA, Korea, etc, etc... (often just over some tiniest issues)

 

China does not need to behave like a giant bully who just cannot bear any criticism, instead feels like they want to make as many enemies as possible.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Guest sgman said:

The problem is that China is not exactly endearing itself to the world.

The Hong Kong issue.

The Taiwan issue.

Trade war with Australia, USA, Korea, etc, etc... (often just over some tiniest issues)

 

China does not need to behave like a giant bully who just cannot bear any criticism, instead feels like they want to make as many enemies as possible.

 

 

Your post is exactly the result of what the western media has achieved - to turn all English speaking countries against China and demonize it.

 

Again you started with a conclusion and selectively chose the very things that Western media fed you with.

 

1. Trade war was started by USA. 

2. Australia benefitted economically from trading with China yet tried the hardest to punish China in the political arena. What China is doing is understandable. (But of course very wrong to Australia. How dare China not buy things from us and let us condemn them at the same time!)

 

3. Where Hong Kong and Taiwan are concerned, if you have no sense of history and the manipulative ways of the Weetern powers, then your views are biased. I agree that it’s internal affairs. Ultimately Hong Kong is part of China and the Hong Kongers have to accept that either China becomes a democracy or Hong Kong becomes part of the a communist regime. If they cannot change China to become democracy, then the only option for them is to migrate.

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26 minutes ago, Guest Hmm said:

I didn't know you liked China this much, Blow away.

 

But to get back to topic, yes, the West has made fake news before. 

 

It's not a phenomenon exclusive to the West though, as someone else has pointed out. There is not a single source of news out there that is truly, 100% unbiased. Doesn't matter what country, what organisation - there is always a slant. It's how close to the truth something is.

 

Having said this, while I would never disagree on the benefit of getting your news from multiple sources (if you are multilingual, even better), if I had to choose, I would be more inclined to trust Western media. When it comes to freedom and human rights, as far as I can tell it is the Western societies which have it better.

 

At least, when mistakes are made, people can talk about them. It has not been lost on me that the video you link is in English, a Western language. We can discuss, critique, debate about the American administration and its involvement in the Vietnam war, Iraq, etc. all we want on the internet. Would we be able to do the same for the Tiananmen Square incident on China's internet/media? I don't think so. 

 

Freedom does make things messy, yes. Just look at US media or Taiwanese media. But at least the truth is guaranteed an opportunity.


Please don’t say I love China. 
I agree with what Lee Kuan Yew has said about democracy but it doesn’t mean I love him.

 

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/388955/

 

For Lee Kuan Yew, the ultimate test of a political system is whether it improves the standard of living for the majority of people.

 

Both Singapore and China have been heavily criticised as having no freedom of press. But they have achieved economic success. The point is, while it’s good to have both freedom of press and economic success, they are not correlated. And if you could choose only one, which one would you choose?

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Guest Western propaganda

It is plain to see that the US has set out to bully China at any opportunity and also engaged the assistance of it's 5 Eyes partners( namely Australia. NZ. CAnada and the UK)

The US is intent on spreading Zionist dominance throughout the world and incorporating proxy governments to wage war on their behalf. Their biggest fear are body bags hence reluctance to engage in direct warfare preferring to utilize militants and militias 

The USA should be exposed for what it is.... The biggest bully in global affairs.

Anyway not to worry.  We are seeing the gradual downfall in American dominance as is borne out in recent events. To be blunt the US wheels are falling off .

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1 minute ago, Guest Western propaganda said:

It is plain to see that the US has set out to bully China at any opportunity and also engaged the assistance of it's 5 Eyes partners( namely Australia. NZ. CAnada and the UK)

The US is intent on spreading Zionist dominance throughout the world and incorporating proxy governments to wage war on their behalf. Their biggest fear are body bags hence reluctance to engage in direct warfare preferring to utilize militants and militias 

The USA should be exposed for what it is.... The biggest bully in global affairs.

Anyway not to worry.  We are seeing the gradual downfall in American dominance as is borne out in recent events. To be blunt the US wheels are falling off .

Not sure if this will be accepted by those brainwashed by the western media. 
 

but I believe majority want peace and prosperity. China which has enjoyed many years of prosperity is now addicted to making more money. Unless you are not ethnic Chinese you would understand that the best way to stop Chinese from waging wars is to make them busy with making money. 
 

all this talk about China being a threat to global order is bullshit. Check out the well established fact that out of 243 years of independence, US has spent 225 years at war.

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/www.thenews.com.pk/amp/595752-the-us-has-been-at-war-225-out-of-243-years-since-1776

 

who is the real bully? Who is a threat to global peace?

 

one just needs to open their eyes to see. But first take off the tinted lens. 

 

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Guest Guest Curious
15 hours ago, Blow away said:

What I find most amazing is that the US and its people thrive on the Cold War mindset. 
 

They need to have an adversary to defeat.

 

Just cos China is going to overtake them economically, so it is their worst enemy right now. 
 

Ever since they dropped the atomic bombs, they know they are capable of inflicting damages. And they never stop inflicting damages ever since then. Cos it’s their way of maintaining dominance. 
 

The world sans the US and its alliance actually welcomes a China that breaks the US hegemony. 

The US is typical of a great power on the slippery slope of decline. It does have a sort of Cold War mindset where everyone it doesn't like is a villain. It all started at the end of World War 2 when it emerged as the only superpower left. It let the French return to take control of Vietnam even though Ho Chi Minh had actually been a US ally during the War. It turned against China because it expected Chiang Kaishek to win the civil war and was then utterly shocked when Mao won with a communist agenda. The unlawful undeclared wars in Laos and Cambodia bookended the utter disaster of the Vietnam War. It turned blind eyes because it was convenient at the millions massacred in East Timor, Bangladesh, Chile and elsewhere. The CIA overturned the democratically elected Prime Minister of Iran and put its money behind the repressive eventually loathed Shah. The problems in Iran today directly stem from that single action in the 1950s. 

 

Then it cosied up to China as a bulwark against Soviet communism. It opened the money floodgates to help China rebuild. China then played the US for all it was worth almost with Washington's blessing.

 

But all great powers rise and fall. Now it is China which is very much on the rise. It will be the superpower of the 21st century as US influence wanes.

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3 minutes ago, Guest Guest Curious said:

The US is typical of a great power on the slippery slope of decline. It does have a sort of Cold War mindset where everyone it doesn't like is a villain. It all started at the end of World War 2 when it emerged as the only superpower left. It let the French return to take control of Vietnam even though Ho Chi Minh had actually been a US ally during the War. It turned against China because it expected Chiang Kaishek to win the civil war and was then utterly shocked when Mao won with a communist agenda. The unlawful undeclared wars in Laos and Cambodia bookended the utter disaster of the Vietnam War. It turned blind eyes because it was convenient at the millions massacred in East Timor, Bangladesh, Chile and elsewhere. The CIA overturned the democratically elected Prime Minister of Iran and put its money behind the repressive eventually loathed Shah. The problems in Iran today directly stem from that single action in the 1950s. 

 

Then it cosied up to China as a bulwark against Soviet communism. It opened the money floodgates to help China rebuild. China then played the US for all it was worth almost with Washington's blessing.

 

But all great powers rise and fall. Now it is China which is very much on the rise. It will be the superpower of the 21st century as US influence wanes.


the rise of China and fall of the US is what we are witnessing now. 
 

what the US is doing now is the last and desperate attempts to hold its position as the no 1 in the world.

 

Kishore Mahbubani kept reminding the US to accept that China will overtake them but why should the US listen to him?

 

The balance of power is now moving to the east. It can only happen if China becomes stronger. Why should this be a bad thing for any country in the Asia? Maybe except Japan and Taiwan which is strictly not a country. 

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Guest Guest
2 hours ago, Blow away said:

The balance of power is now moving to the east. It can only happen if China becomes stronger. Why should this be a bad thing for any country in the Asia? Maybe except Japan and Taiwan which is strictly not a country. 

 

That' "Why should this be a bad thing for any country in the Asia?" is such a scary excuse to garner support for China. I'm sure some people must have used that same excuse to propagate the Japanese propaganda to all the other countries during World War 3. And look what the Japanese did to every other nationalities during the war. Don't forget: just because the colour of your skin is the same, doesn't mean that people of other nationalities will acknowledge you as their own kind, even if you might share relationships 3 to 4 generations ago. 

 

Be careful of the spread of such propaganda online. The rise of power to the East doesn't mean the spread of wealth will be distributed evenly. You might just become cash cows for the more powerful nations to suck your lives out from. 

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16 minutes ago, Guest Guest said:

 

That' "Why should this be a bad thing for any country in the Asia?" is such a scary excuse to garner support for China. I'm sure some people must have used that same excuse to propagate the Japanese propaganda to all the other countries during World War 3. And look what the Japanese did to every other nationalities during the war. Don't forget: just because the colour of your skin is the same, doesn't mean that people of other nationalities will acknowledge you as their own kind, even if you might share relationships 3 to 4 generations ago. 

 

Be careful of the spread of such propaganda online. The rise of power to the East doesn't mean the spread of wealth will be distributed evenly. You might just become cash cows for the more powerful nations to suck your lives out from. 


I am against the hypocrisy of the US and western media. That’s all I am trying to say.

 

it’s funny that you wrote that I support China. I am only saying that China is undeniably becoming a superpower that counters the US. 
 

what I have written is not propaganda but based on what is happening around us. It has been predicted by LKY and Kishore Mahbubani amongst many that China will rise again. It’s now become a reality in 2021. But it’s still not accepted by many especially those who have only followed western media. 
 

When you wrote things like I am garnering support for China it just weakens your reasoning. All I did was to show how western media is bias and hypocritical. It just happened that China is their whipping boy now. Me exposing western media and me garnering support for China are 2 different issues. Please do not make things up. China doesn’t need my support or yours. Its economy will surpass US in a matter of years with or without our support. 
 

How is an economic fact propaganda?

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1 hour ago, Guest Guest said:

 

That' "Why should this be a bad thing for any country in the Asia?" is such a scary excuse to garner support for China. I'm sure some people must have used that same excuse to propagate the Japanese propaganda to all the other countries during World War 3. And look what the Japanese did to every other nationalities during the war. Don't forget: just because the colour of your skin is the same, doesn't mean that people of other nationalities will acknowledge you as their own kind, even if you might share relationships 3 to 4 generations ago. 

 

Be careful of the spread of such propaganda online. The rise of power to the East doesn't mean the spread of wealth will be distributed evenly. You might just become cash cows for the more powerful nations to suck your lives out from. 

In case you have not been following the latest news.

 

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2021/03/18/nyregion/asian-hate-crimes.amp.html

 

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-56424616

 

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/asian-woman-attacked-san-francisco-fights-back/
 

which is better? To be ignored by people of same skin colour or to be attacked by another race?

 

Can you also understand how racial hate crimes occur?

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On 3/19/2021 at 12:01 AM, Blow away said:

Remember the first people that Trump banned from coming to the US were the muslims. 

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/president-obama-ban-muslims-2011/

** Comments are my opinions, same as yours. It's not a 'Be-All-and-End-All' view. Intent's to thought-provoke, validate, reiterate and yes, even correct. Opinion to consider but agree to disagree. I don't enjoy conflicted exchanges, empty bravado or egoistical chest pounding. It's never personal, tribalistic or with malice. Frank by nature, means, I never bend the truth. Views are to broaden understanding - Updated: Nov 2021.

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On 3/18/2021 at 11:55 AM, Blow away said:

What I find most amazing is that the US and its people thrive on the Cold War mindset. 
 

They need to have an adversary to defeat.

 

Just cos China is going to overtake them economically, so it is their worst enemy right now. 
 

Ever since they dropped the atomic bombs, they know they are capable of inflicting damages. And they never stop inflicting damages ever since then. Cos it’s their way of maintaining dominance. 
 

The world sans the US and its alliance actually welcomes a China that breaks the US hegemony. 

 

How you justify your demonizing of the US?   I'm not criticizing you,  I am simply curious of how you came to your conclusions about America. 

 

I will justify why I see America different than you do. 

1- America's enemies are usually very rogue countries, like N. Korea, Russia, and many Islamic countries. 

2- America's allies are usually progressive countries with good standards of human rights, like most European countries, Asian countries except China. 

3- America has a Constitution that is a model of civility which has endured a very long time and is in full effect today.  The avoidance of a totalitarian Trump regime and the successful establishment of his opposition following a valid election,  with minimum disturbance which didn't go beyond an attempt to seize the Capitol, reaffirmed the solid roots of a non-totalitarian government,  something out of the ordinary.   I write "non-totalitarian" instead of "democratic",  because the American elections are far from being truly democratic.

4- America usually is a generous country that helps the world community beyond its fair share.  Exception is made only for the 4 years of the Trump administration.  America was central to the reconstruction of Europe and Japan after WWII and Japan was allowed to keep its Emperor. The Marshal plan helped European economies and contributed to German's Wirtshaftswunder ( economic miracle).   America participated in the creation of the United Nations with its World Health Organization, and the NATO alliance. 

5- Much of the evil that is attributable to America is not due to its "regime"  but to the incompetence, political positions by profiteering sectors of its government.  The US with a decent government is welcomed by the world.  It is possible that the Biden administration will be such a government.

.

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54 minutes ago, Steve5380 said:

 

How you justify your demonizing of the US?   I'm not criticizing you,  I am simply curious of how you came to your conclusions about America. 

 

I will justify why I see America different than you do. 

1- America's enemies are usually very rogue countries, like N. Korea, Russia, and many Islamic countries. 

2- America's allies are usually progressive countries with good standards of human rights, like most European countries, Asian countries except China. 

3- America has a Constitution that is a model of civility which has endured a very long time and is in full effect today.  The avoidance of a totalitarian Trump regime and the successful establishment of his opposition following a valid election,  with minimum disturbance which didn't go beyond an attempt to seize the Capitol, reaffirmed the solid roots of a non-totalitarian government,  something out of the ordinary.   I write "non-totalitarian" instead of "democratic",  because the American elections are far from being truly democratic.

4- America usually is a generous country that helps the world community beyond its fare share.  Exception made only for the 4 years of the Trump administration.  America was central to the reconstruction of Europe and Japan after WWII and Japan was allowed to keep its Emperor. The Marshal plan helped European economies and contributed to German's Wirtshaftswunder ( economic miracle).   America participated in the creation of the United Nations with its World Health Organization and the NATO alliance. 

5- Much of the evil that is attributable to America is not due to its "regime"  but to the incompetence, political positions by profiteering sectors of its government.  The US with a decent government is welcomed by the world.  It is possible that the Biden administration will be such a government.


I don’t think I am demonising the US. I insist I am calling out it’s double standards and use of military force and subversion to subvert and overthrow other governments. 
 

One of my favourite sources of news actually comes from Taiwan. Taiwan is in a unique position in that the majority of its population wants to become independent. Many of them are anti-China for the sake of opposing China. 
 

Yet there is a group of Taiwanese political observers who are more objective than others. They are not swayed by emotions and they use logic to analyse the rise of China and its impact on Taiwan and the global scene.

 

 

You have to understand Chinese to see that some of the things mentioned actually answers what you have written.

 

I think that the points you wrote are opinions not shared by everyone. 
 

I don’t wish to go into never ending arguments on human rights. Cos different countries define human rights in different ways. Just want to share a real example. The US has lost its moral authority when it decides to put the lives of its citizens as priority when it comes to vaccination. China on the other hand exports its vaccine to many poor countries even before it gives the vaccine to its own people. When the US says Americans first and the rest are second class global citizens, nobody would listen to it when they talk about human rights. To many countries watching it’s just noise and entertainment and interference of China’s internal affairs. 


Another example is the contrast in the way US and China managed Covid pandemic.

 

China insists that the freedom to live, freedom to have a roof, freedom to have a job and freedom to roam the streets at night safely are also human rights. The same things have been said by our minister when BBC questioned Singapore’s freedom of press records.
 

 

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7 minutes ago, Blow away said:


I don’t think I am demonising the US. I insist I am calling out it’s double standards and use of military force and subversion to subvert and overthrow other governments. 
 

One of my favourite sources of news actually comes from Taiwan. Taiwan is in a unique position in that the majority of its population wants to become independent. Many of them are anti-China for the sake of opposing China. 
 

Yet there is a group of Taiwanese political observers who are more objective than others. They are not swayed by emotions and they use logic to analyse the rise of China and its impact on Taiwan and the global scene.

 

 

You have to understand Chinese to see that some of the things mentioned actually answers what you have written.

 

I think that the points you wrote are opinions not shared by everyone. 
 

I don’t wish to go into never ending arguments on human rights. Cos different countries define human rights in different ways. Just want to share a real example. The US has lost its moral authority when it decides to put the lives of its citizens as priority when it comes to vaccination. China on the other hand exports its vaccine to many poor countries even before it gives the vaccine to its own people. When the US says Americans first and the rest are second class global citizens, nobody would listen to it when they talk about human rights. To many countries watching it’s just noise and entertainment and interference of China’s internal affairs. 


Another example is the contrast in the way US and China managed Covid pandemic.

 

China insists that the freedom to live, freedom to have a roof, freedom to have a job and freedom to roam the streets at night safely are also human rights. The same things have been said by our minister when BBC questioned Singapore’s freedom of press records.
 

 

Assuming @Steve5380is unable to find a translation of the talk show, CTI TV is pro totalitarian dictatorship.

 

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Guest Guest
15 hours ago, Blow away said:


I am against the hypocrisy of the US and western media. That’s all I am trying to say.

 

it’s funny that you wrote that I support China. I am only saying that China is undeniably becoming a superpower that counters the US. 
 

what I have written is not propaganda but based on what is happening around us. It has been predicted by LKY and Kishore Mahbubani amongst many that China will rise again. It’s now become a reality in 2021. But it’s still not accepted by many especially those who have only followed western media. 
 

When you wrote things like I am garnering support for China it just weakens your reasoning. All I did was to show how western media is bias and hypocritical. It just happened that China is their whipping boy now. Me exposing western media and me garnering support for China are 2 different issues. Please do not make things up. China doesn’t need my support or yours. Its economy will surpass US in a matter of years with or without our support. 
 

How is an economic fact propaganda?

 

And do you really think the Chinese media is not hypocritical? So what if China will become the next economic superpower? Does that give the country the right to behave so arrogantly towards other nations, including Singapore when they got the Hong Kong authorities to block the shipment of our tanks back to our own country after they were sent overseas for training exercise purposes? 

 

China is the whipping boy of almost every other country.  The rest of the other countries are keeping silent on the arrogance of China only on account of them becoming a superpower. 

 

The fact that you can even use LKY and Kishore's statements here to garner even more support for China needs to be called out immediately. Make no mistake that everyone is falling for your trickery. 

 

It is obvious that you are trying to binarize the situation into a good and bad situation. Regardless if the USA media is hypocritical or not, that doesn't mean that China is any type of angels. As a matter of fact, both countries can be just as demonical as the other.  

 

You claim that you are calling out on the hypocrisy of western media. But yet you remain silent on the stonewalling of the Chinese media. So what does that make you? A hypocrite? 

 

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50 minutes ago, Blow away said:


 

 

You have to understand Chinese to see that some of the things mentioned actually answers what you have written.

 

 

I would never give you an answer to a post of yours that includes a video that you don't understand.  You  SHOULD know that I cannot understand a word of this video you posted.  Why you do this?   Cannot you find an example that is in English, or has subtitles in a Western language?

 

50 minutes ago, Blow away said:

 

I don’t wish to go into never ending arguments on human rights. Cos different countries define human rights in different ways. Just want to share a real example. The US has lost its moral authority when it decides to put the lives of its citizens as priority when it comes to vaccination. China on the other hand exports its vaccine to many poor countries even before it gives the vaccine to its own people. When the US says Americans first and the rest are second class global citizens, nobody would listen to it when they talk about human rights. To many countries watching it’s just noise and entertainment and interference of China’s internal affairs. 

 

 

WHAT ????   For you, a country that gives priority to its own citizens ... loses its moral authority?   What kind of MORAL is this?    If you have just enough preventive medicine to treat your family,  say your parents, wife, children...   would you give it away to treat strangers instead of giving it to the members of your family?  Who says this is MORAL?  Our obligation is to OUR dependents FIRST!   And how you come up with the idea that giving priority to YOUR people is treating other people as second class?   If there is famine and you have at home just enough food to feed your spouse and children,  should you leave them hungry and give the food to strangers instead?  The Biden administration has worked hard to procure more than enough vaccines for its population, and has already plans to donate the rest to other needy countries.

 

50 minutes ago, Blow away said:

 

China insists that the freedom to live, freedom to have a roof, freedom to have a job and freedom to roam the streets at night safely are also human rights. The same things have been said by our minister when BBC questioned Singapore’s freedom of press records.
 

 

What value have moral statements by government officials?  What China "insists" is what it cares about?  And who fact-checks what your politicians say?  Do you think that people in mainland China have more freedoms and rights than people in Taiwan?

.

 

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17 minutes ago, wilfgene said:

 

Assuming @Steve5380is unable to find a translation of the talk show, CTI TV is pro totalitarian dictatorship.

 

 

Thank you.

This baffled me the most:  to quote a talk in Chinese to a Texan, or South American.  

There are translating programs for text,  but I don't have any translators for speech.  There might be, but I have never used one.

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28 minutes ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Thank you.

This baffled me the most:  to quote a talk in Chinese to a Texan, or South American.  

There are translating programs for text,  but I don't have any translators for speech.  There might be, but I have never used one.


Actually this does show something. Those who understand only English will have no access to the perspectives of those who use Chinese exclusively. This is why it is important that the mass media be as objective and less bias as possible.

 

Unfortunately the western media is not doing a very good job where China is concerned now.

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https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/us-china-alaska-meeting-tough-talks-conclude-14449574
 

I see the wrestle between China and US as a political game that is fun to watch.

 

If you read between the lines, the body language, the small details and behind the scenes of the just concluded Alaska meeting, you would see things that are not reported in the news.

 

Each official was given 2 minutes in their opening speech, but one Chinese minister took more than 4 minutes and the other took more than 16 minutes to chastise the US. Do you know what that means?

 

When someone here reduces the discussion to me garnering support for China, he or she degrades the entire discussion. It’s not fun to engage such discussion. You support China you Chinese pig. You support US you US doggie. How fun or childish is that?

 

 

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Guest Guest Curious
2 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

1- America's enemies are usually very rogue countries, like N. Korea, Russia, and many Islamic countries. 

 

4- America usually is a generous country that helps the world community beyond its fair share.  Exception is made only for the 4 years of the Trump administration.  America was central to the reconstruction of Europe and Japan after WWII and Japan was allowed to keep its Emperor. The Marshal plan helped European economies and contributed to German's Wirtshaftswunder ( economic miracle).   America participated in the creation of the United Nations with its World Health Organization, and the NATO alliance. 

Too much here to reply to more than two.

 

 1. Usually Rogue Countries. Yes, those you listed are indeed rogue countries. However,  you fail to make any mention whatever of America's unilateral use of its massive power against countries which could not be described as 'rogue'. Rather they were merely inconveniences to its ambitions. Why did the US arrange for a democratically elected Prime Minster of Iran to be deposed and have to flee the country in the early 1950s? Iran was not then a rogue nation. Unfortunately it controlled a lot of oil and it wanted greater control of its own oil. America wanted to keep control. So it had the CIA get rid of the elected government. This has nothing whatever to do with Islam. The reason was purely  profit.

 

What had Laos done to the USA? Nothing, apart from fear in the corridors of power in Washington that it would become communist. So the CIA formed Air America to bomb it. It even constructed an airstrip in the Lao jungle that was never on any world map and which was at the time the most active airport in the world. Over 9 agonising years Laos became the most bombed country in history. The CIA and its henchmen dropped a planeload of bombs over tiny land locked Laos at the rate of 1 every 8 minutes for 9 years. Since the end of the undeclared war, the US has offered a pittance to clean up the mass of unexploded bombs. The result is that over 20,000 civilians have been killed since then, over 40% children. Many continue to be killed every year.

 

What had Cambodia done to the USA? The Ho Chi Minh trail may have wandered into Cambodia but Nixon had no mandate to bomb Cambodia. Illegally, he did and the consequences for that beautiful people were horrendous. The bombing created a vacuum that led directly to the rise of the Khmer Rouge and the Killing Fields. More than 1.5 million citizens murdered in cold blood directly as a result of US actions. 

 

What did America's ally Ho Chi Minh ask Roosevelt and Hoover for other than independence? The USA could have stopped the French from returning. It did not. That led directly to the Vietnam War and the death of 3  million Vietnamese. For what? A unified Vietnam. All those deaths were unnecessary.

 

4. Here I agree. America has indeed been a force for good in many respects. Although it did not wish to become involved in the Nazi War, it provided aid to the UK. When Hitler then declared was on the USA, it sent masses of troops and materiel necessary to ensure that the European allies could win the war. The Marshall Plan to rebuild Europe quickly was an amazing act of generosity. But - and its a big but - this was as much in America's interest as Europe's. The US fear was that Stalin would not stop at Berlin and that his triumphant forces would just keep marching on till it reached the Atlantic Ocean. The Marshall Plan was largely to ensure this did not happen. The US looking after its own interests.

 

As far as Japan keeping its Emperor, you only have to read history to know that the US pro-consul MacArthur made the decision out of fear - fear that without the Emperor the Japanese people would commit ritual mass suicide. With the Soviet Union virtually on Japan's borders, the US needed Japan and military bases in Japan. Keeping the Emperor was in the US best interests.

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1 hour ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Thank you.

This baffled me the most:  to quote a talk in Chinese to a Texan, or South American.  

There are translating programs for text,  but I don't have any translators for speech.  There might be, but I have never used one.

Another alternative is this

It’s by CNA. But read the comments. They are mostly not Chinese or pro-China though some may be anti-US.

 

Someone earlier wrote that China is the world’s whipping boy now. That person is the exact product of western media. The comments here should tell him that there is a lot of people outside of the west who are not pro-China but very anti-US. They are just happy to see any country stand up against the US.

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Guest fake news

I guess the fake news started with the Pharaohs and Roman emperors...

 

The thing is about manipulation . To make people believe something untrue.

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50 minutes ago, Guest fake news said:

I guess the fake news started with the Pharaohs and Roman emperors...

 

The thing is about manipulation . To make people believe something untrue.

When enough people believe in something, it becomes true. 

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Guest Guest Curious
5 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

I would never give you an answer to a post of yours that includes a video that you don't understand.  You  SHOULD know that I cannot understand a word of this video you posted.  Why you do this?   Cannot you find an example that is in English, or has subtitles in a Western language?

What arrogance! You criticise a poster for posting on a Singapore site in what is either his native language or one of the country's official languages. Why should anyone need to know what languages any other poster might or might not understand? If a poster cannot understand Chinese, he can learn it. Or he can move to other chat rooms where the language is only English.

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5 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Thank you.

This baffled me the most:  to quote a talk in Chinese to a Texan, or South American.  

There are translating programs for text,  but I don't have any translators for speech.  There might be, but I have never used one.

His choice of a source of information speaks louder than his talk.

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4 hours ago, Guest Guest Curious said:

What arrogance! You criticise a poster for posting on a Singapore site in what is either his native language or one of the country's official languages. Why should anyone need to know what languages any other poster might or might not understand? If a poster cannot understand Chinese, he can learn it. Or he can move to other chat rooms where the language is only English.


i don’t think Steve was being arrogant. I wish there is a way to get him to watch the video to understand what’s discussed. 
 

I enjoy rational debates where opinions are backed by facts and opinions. Unfortunately not many are callable of that beyond making slurs and name calling. I would love to engage them but in the end it’s like 对牛弹琴。

 

What’s interesting about the Alaska meeting is that the US had prepared a script for the meet. Before the meet, the US visited Japan and Korea which are China’s neighbours. Then US and Japan issued a joint statement to criticise China. Finally US sanctioned 24 China and Hong Kong officials. When the meeting began, both US officials lambasted China roundly.

 

What happened next was totally out of script. The Chinese official Yang took 15 minutes to lash out at the US officials catching them totally offguard. Perhaps they were expecting a meek response. It only goes to show that they were inexperienced in the presence of someone known as Tiger Yang. 
 

The Chinese press declared it a victory for the China team. While the western media just reported it as a heated argument between both sides. No other country in the history of political diplomacy has ever done what China just did - by spelling out American atrocities and failures right in their face. And this is why it is so fascinating. 

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11 hours ago, Blow away said:


Actually this does show something. Those who understand only English will have no access to the perspectives of those who use Chinese exclusively. This is why it is important that the mass media be as objective and less bias as possible.

 

Unfortunately the western media is not doing a very good job where China is concerned now.

 

Those who understand only ONE language, the one of their country of origin, have a void in their education.  This is the case with many Americans, and many Chinese.

 

A complete education should include at least two languages, and many westerners we speak multiple languages.  But they are usually western languages.  Mandarin is too difficult, too different a language for us to become proficient unless we have a real need.   And here is the issue of need:  it is more important for a Chinese, for a Japanese, for a Malaysian, for a Thai, for a South Korean to speak English,  than for an American to learn these eastern languages. 

 

In today's world, no language is inaccessible to anybody.  I could have understood your video had I taken the trouble to extract its audio and find a translator of voice.  My observation was about the failure to make the response to the interlocutor understandable to him,  in the common language English, or whatever language the other person understands. 

 

10 hours ago, Blow away said:

Another alternative is this

It’s by CNA. But read the comments. They are mostly not Chinese or pro-China though some may be anti-US.

 

Someone earlier wrote that China is the world’s whipping boy now. That person is the exact product of western media. The comments here should tell him that there is a lot of people outside of the west who are not pro-China but very anti-US. They are just happy to see any country stand up against the US.

 

Thank you.

 

I understand how China has a different concept of "human rights" and some of its violations have been exaggerated by the Western press, and the West needs to accept them.  But there are other issues that cannot be justified easily.

 

China is showing an expansionist attitude.  The territories of Taiwan, of Hong Kong, are not significant compared to the extent of mainland China.  Why cannot they be independent?  Why is China launching a dominance of the South China sea?  

 

In contrast, America has never been expansionist by force.  It pacifically BOUGHT some territories from other nations.  Having invaded Europe and gained control of Japan at the end of WWII,  it didn't make them colonies.   America prevailed over Iraq,  but it didn't take their oil.  This was only the idea of Trump.  The legal principles of America are pacific, but their leaders are not always so.  A decent American government will not try to colonize weaker nations and take away their resources.

.

Edited by Steve5380
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6 hours ago, Guest Guest Curious said:

What arrogance! You criticise a poster for posting on a Singapore site in what is either his native language or one of the country's official languages. Why should anyone need to know what languages any other poster might or might not understand? If a poster cannot understand Chinese, he can learn it. Or he can move to other chat rooms where the language is only English.

 

How arrogant you are!  In a conversation you use YOUR language and don't care if it is understood by those you speak with. 

 

If you are Singaporean, you seem to forget that in your multicultural country there is a LINGUA FRANCA, which is English.  And you learn it in school .  You have Chinese, Malays, Muslims in addition to a few English westerners. 

 

I never see here whole posts or even whole threads written in Malay, or Arabic.  But I find frequently long exchanges of posts written in Mandarin.  What is keeping the Chinese group from writing in English?  You ethnic Chinese expect your Malay, Arab countrymen to understand your Mandarin??  English is an IMPORTANT language, very important to speak and write it WELL.   This is why you learn it in school, and here you have the opportunity to practice it.

 

And I am not trying to promote MY language.  English is not my native language,  I was raised with German and Spanish.  I had to learn English like you and many others here, and I am still learning it, many new words, new expressions, new constructs.  

 

Good, and better, PERFECT English helps open the doors for good positions of employment.  If you want to become an important person, then use an impeccable English/ But your accent is not important.  On the contrary, to keep a "foreign" accent gives you an aura of cuteness and sophistication!  :)   It gives the message:  "even if I am not an Englishman, I have the intelligence, the smartness and the discipline to learn your language perfectly" :thumb:

.

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1 hour ago, Blow away said:

 

What’s interesting about the Alaska meeting is that the US had prepared a script for the meet. Before the meet, the US visited Japan and Korea which are China’s neighbours. Then US and Japan issued a joint statement to criticise China. Finally US sanctioned 24 China and Hong Kong officials. When the meeting began, both US officials lambasted China roundly.

 

What happened next was totally out of script. The Chinese official Yang took 15 minutes to lash out at the US officials catching them totally offguard. Perhaps they were expecting a meek response. It only goes to show that they were inexperienced in the presence of someone known as Tiger Yang. 
 

The Chinese press declared it a victory for the China team. While the western media just reported it as a heated argument between both sides. No other country in the history of political diplomacy has ever done what China just did - by spelling out American atrocities and failures right in their face. And this is why it is so fascinating. 

 

 

LOL!  I also think this meeting must have been interesting.  Maybe both parties in the talk telling each other what they didn't want to hear could be a good beginning.  Like what Putin said to Biden years ago "now we understand each other".   After American TRUMP insulted and belittled every other foreign leader,  these leaders are entitled now to come down to the Americans without reservations.  :lol: 

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Guest Guest Curious
1 hour ago, Steve5380 said:

Mandarin is too difficult, too different a language for us to become proficient unless we have a real need.   And here is the issue of need:  it is more important for a Chinese, for a Japanese, for a Malaysian, for a Thai, for a South Korean to speak English,  than for an American to learn these eastern languages. 

What a colonialist attitude. So the westerners who live and work in those Asian countries and speak the languages found them too difficult to learn? Tell that to an American friend of mine who speaks fluent Mandarin, Shanghainese and Cantonese. And others who speak near fluent Japanese. Mandarin Chinese is now taught in many schools throughout Europe and Australia.

 

53 minutes ago, Steve5380 said:

I never see here whole posts or even whole threads written in Malay, or Arabic.  But I find frequently long exchanges of posts written in Mandarin.  What is keeping the Chinese group from writing in English?

So you would turn BW into a western forum by insisting on only English? Singaporean Chinese cannot use their own family language? How ridiculous. 

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48 minutes ago, Guest Guest Curious said:

What a colonialist attitude. So the westerners who live and work in those Asian countries and speak the languages found them too difficult to learn? Tell that to an American friend of mine who speaks fluent Mandarin, Shanghainese and Cantonese. And others who speak near fluent Japanese. Mandarin Chinese is now taught in many schools throughout Europe and Australia.

 

So you would turn BW into a western forum by insisting on only English? Singaporean Chinese cannot use their own family language? How ridiculous. 

 

Colonialist attitude?  I have nothing to do with colonies, I never lived in one.

.

 

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Guest Guest Curious
1 hour ago, Steve5380 said:

America has never been expansionist by force.  It pacifically BOUGHT some territories from other nations.  Having invaded Europe and gained control of Japan at the end of WWII,  it didn't make them colonies.   America prevailed over Iraq,  but it didn't take their oil.  This was only the idea of Trump.  The legal principles of America are pacific, but their leaders are not always so.  A decent American government will not try to colonize weaker nations and take away their resources.

Once again it's time for you to look back at history again. You state "America prevailed over Iraq, but it didn't take their oil." Not what America's neo-con right wingers said and not fact. Paul Wolfowitz and others said very clearly that the war would "self financing" and paid for "via Iraqi oil". Before America's invasion, Iraqi oil was fully nationalised. Within 10 years of the invasion it had become fully open for international exploitation by western Big Oil like ExxonMobil, Chevron and BP.

 

America was not expansionist? How about the Mexican-American war by which America grabbed parts of Mexico? This was a product of expansionist-minded politicians headed by President James Polk. Then there was the Spanish-American War in which America grabbed the rest of Mexico. As part of the peace treaty the Spanish had to hand over its colony of The Philippines to the USA. Initially Filipino leaders believed American propaganda that the war was to free colonial peoples. They soon learned that these were mere words not reflected in deeds. This produced the three year Philippine War with the US taking part in many atrocities. One of the most prominent and vociferous campaigners for American imperialism was Senator Albert Beveridge who said, “God has marked the American people as His chosen nation to finally lead in the regeneration of the world. This is the divine mission of America, and it holds for us all the profit, all the glory, all the happiness possible to man.” The US held on to that colony for 48 years.

 

How about the chunk of the China coast grabbed by the USA along with other western powers? What about the flood of missionaries it sent to Asia to convert heathen souls for Christ and other parts of Asia? America fought for colonies just as other western powers did.

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7 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Those who understand only ONE language, the one of their country of origin, have a void in their education.  This is the case with many Americans, and many Chinese.

 

A complete education should include at least two languages, and many westerners we speak multiple languages.  But they are usually western languages.  Mandarin is too difficult, too different a language for us to become proficient unless we have a real need.   And here is the issue of need:  it is more important for a Chinese, for a Japanese, for a Malaysian, for a Thai, for a South Korean to speak English,  than for an American to learn these eastern languages. 

 

In today's world, no language is inaccessible to anybody.  I could have understood your video had I taken the trouble to extract its audio and find a translator of voice.  My observation was about the failure to make the response to the interlocutor understandable to him,  in the common language English, or whatever language the other person understands. 

 

 

Thank you.

 

I understand how China has a different concept of "human rights" and some of its violations have been exaggerated by the Western press, and the West needs to accept them.  But there are other issues that cannot be justified easily.

 

China is showing an expansionist attitude.  The territories of Taiwan, of Hong Kong, are not significant compared to the extent of mainland China.  Why cannot they be independent?  Why is China launching a dominance of the South China sea?  

 

In contrast, America has never been expansionist by force.  It pacifically BOUGHT some territories from other nations.  Having invaded Europe and gained control of Japan at the end of WWII,  it didn't make them colonies.   America prevailed over Iraq,  but it didn't take their oil.  This was only the idea of Trump.  The legal principles of America are pacific, but their leaders are not always so.  A decent American government will not try to colonize weaker nations and take away their resources.

.

Please brush up on your knowledge of history before we can talk about the same thing. 
 

China being expansionist and US no? This will be the biggest joke of the century. 

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this is taken from Facebook. Part 1
I’m from Malaysia. China has traded with Malaysia for 2000 years. In those years, they had been the world’s biggest powers many times. Never once they sent troops to take our land. Admiral Zhenghe came to Malacca five times, in gigantic fleets, and a flagship eight times the size of Christopher Columbus’ flagship, Santa Maria. He could have seized Malacca easily, but he did not. In 1511, the Portuguese came. In 1642, the Dutch came. In the 18th century the British came. We were colonised by each, one after another.
When China wanted spices from India, they traded with the Indians. When they wanted gems, they traded with the Persian. They didn’t take lands. The only time China expanded beyond their current borders was in Yuan Dynasty, when Genghis and his descendants Ogedei Khan, Guyuk Khan & Kublai Khan concurred China, Mid Asia and Eastern Europe. But Yuan Dynasty, although being based in China, was a part of the Mongolian Empire. Then came the Century of Humiliation. Britain smuggled opium into China to dope the population, a strategy to turn the trade deficit around, after the British could not find enough silver to pay the Qing Dynasty in their tea and porcelain trades. After the opium warehouses were burned down and ports were closed by the Chinese in ordered to curb opium, the British started the Opium War I, which China lost. Hong Kong was forced to be surrendered to the British in a peace talk (Nanjing Treaty). The British owned 90% of the opium market in China, during that time, Queen Victoria was the world’s biggest drug baron. The remaining 10% was owned by American merchants from Boston. Many of Boston’s institutions were built with profit from opium. After 12 years of Nanjing Treaty, the West started getting really really greedy. The British wanted the Qing government: 1. To open the borders of China to allow goods coming in and out freely, and tax free. 2. Make opium legal in China. Insane requests, Qing government said no. The British and French, with supports from the US and Russia from behind, started Opium War II with China, which again, China lost. The Anglo-French military raided the Summer Palace, and threatened to burn down the Imperial Palace, the Qing government was forced to pay with ports, free business zones, 300,000 kilograms of silver and Kowloon was taken. Since then, China’s resources flew out freely through these business zones and ports. In the subsequent amendment to the treaties, Chinese people were sold overseas to serve as labor. In 1900, China suffered attacks by the 8-National Alliance(Japan, Russia, Britain, France, USA, Germany, Italy, Austria-Hungary). Innocent Chinese civilians in Peking (Beijing now) were murdered, buildings were destroyed & women were raped. The Imperial Palace was raided, and treasures ended up in museums like the British Museum in London and the Louvre in Paris. In late 1930s China was occupied by the Japanese in WWII. Millions of Chinese died during the occupancy. 300,000 Chinese died in Nanjing Massacre alone. Mao brought China together again from the shambles. There were peace and unity for some time. But Mao’s later reign saw sufferings and deaths from famine and power struggles. Then came Deng Xiao Ping and his infamous “black-cat and white-cat” story. His preference in pragmatism than ideologies has transformed China. This thinking allowed China to evolve all the time to adapt to the actual needs in the country, instead of rigidly bounded to ideologies. It also signified the death of Communism in actually practice in China. The current Socialism+Meritocracy+Market Economy model fits the Chinese like gloves, and it propels the uprise of China. Singapore has a similar model, and has been arguably more successful than Hong Kong, because Hong Kong being gateway to China, was riding on the economic boom in China, while Singapore had no one to gain from. In just 30 years, the CPC have moved 800 millions of people out from poverty. The rate of growth is unprecedented in human history. They have built the biggest mobile network, by far the biggest high speed rail network in the world, and they have become a behemoth in infrastructure. They made a fishing village called Shenzhen into the world’s second largest technological centre after the Silicon Valley. They are growing into a technological power house. It has the most elaborate e-commerce and cashless payment system in the world. They have launched exploration to Mars. The Chinese are living a good life and China has become one of the safest countries in the world. The level of patriotism in the country has reached an unprecedented height.

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Part 2

For all of the achievements, the West has nothing good to say about it. China suffers from intense anti-China propagandas from the West. Western Media used the keyword “Communist” to instil fear and hatred towards China. Everything China does is negatively reported. They claimed China used slave labor in making iPhones. The truth was, Apple was the most profitable company in the world, it took most of the profit, leave some to Foxconn (a Taiwanese company) and little to the labor. They claimed China was inhuman with one-child policy. At the same time, they accused China of polluting the earth with its huge population. The fact is the Chinese consume just 30% of energy per capita compared to the US. They claimed China underwent ethnic cleansing in Xinjiang. The fact is China has a policy which priorities ethnic minorities. For a long time, the ethnic minorities were allowed to have two children and the majority Han only allowed one. The minorities are allowed a lower score for university intakes. There are 39,000 mosque in China, and 2100 in the US. China has about 3 times more mosque per muslim than the US. When terrorist attacks happened in Xinjiang, China had two choices: 1. Re-educate the Uighur extremists before they turned terrorists. 2. Let them be, after they launch attacks and killed innocent people, bomb their homes. China chose 1 to solve problem from the root and not to do killing. How the US solve terrorism? Fire missiles from battleships, drop bombs from the sky. During the pandemic, When China took extreme measures to lockdown the people, they were accused of being inhuman. When China recovered swiftly because of the extreme measures, they were accused of lying about the actual numbers. When China’s cases became so low that they could provide medical support to other countries, they were accused of politically motivated. Western Media always have reasons to bash China. Just like any country, there are irresponsible individuals from China which do bad and dirty things, but the China government overall has done very well. But I hear this comment over and over by people from the West: I like Chinese people, but the CPC is evil. What they really want is the Chinese to change the government, because the current one is too good. Fortunately China is not a multi-party democratic country, otherwise the opposition party in China will be supported by notorious NGOs (Non-Government Organization) of the USA, like the NED (National Endowment for Democracy), to topple the ruling party. The US and the British couldn’t crack Mainland China, so they work on Hong Kong. Of all the ex-British colonial countries, only the Hong Kongers were offered BNOs by the British. Because the UK would like the Hong Kongers to think they are British citizens, not Chinese. A divide-and-conquer strategy, which they often used in Color Revolutions around the world. They resort to low dirty tricks like detaining Huawei’s CFO & banning Huawei. They raised a silly trade war which benefits no one. Trade deficit always exist between a developing and a developed country. USA is like a luxury car seller who ask a farmer: why am I always buying your vegetables and you haven’t bought any of my cars? When the Chinese were making socks for the world 30 years ago, the world let it be. But when Chinese started to make high technology products, like Huawei and DJI, it caused red-alert. Because when Western and Japanese products are equal to Chinese in technologies, they could never match the Chinese in prices. First world countries want China to continue in making socks. Instead of stepping up themselves, they want to pull China down. The recent movement by the US against China has a very important background. When Libya, Iran, and China decided to ditch the US dollar in oil trades, Gaddafi’s was killed by the US, Iran was being sanctioned by the US, and now it’s China’s turn. The US has been printing money out of nothing. The only reason why the US Dollar is still widely accepted, is because it’s the only currency which oil is allowed to be traded with. The US has an agreement with Saudi that oil must be traded in US dollar ONLY. Without the petrol-dollar status, the US dollars will sink, and America will fall. Therefore anyone trying to disobey this order will be eliminated. China will soon use a gold-backed crypto-currency, the alarms in the White House go off like mad. China’s achievement has been by hard work. Not by looting the world. I have deep sympathy for China for all the suffering, but now I feel happy for them. China is not rising, they are going back to where they belong. Good luck China.

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7 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Those who understand only ONE language, the one of their country of origin, have a void in their education.  This is the case with many Americans, and many Chinese.

 

A complete education should include at least two languages, and many westerners we speak multiple languages.  But they are usually western languages.  Mandarin is too difficult, too different a language for us to become proficient unless we have a real need.   And here is the issue of need:  it is more important for a Chinese, for a Japanese, for a Malaysian, for a Thai, for a South Korean to speak English,  than for an American to learn these eastern languages. 

 

In today's world, no language is inaccessible to anybody.  I could have understood your video had I taken the trouble to extract its audio and find a translator of voice.  My observation was about the failure to make the response to the interlocutor understandable to him,  in the common language English, or whatever language the other person understands. 

 

 

Thank you.

 

I understand how China has a different concept of "human rights" and some of its violations have been exaggerated by the Western press, and the West needs to accept them.  But there are other issues that cannot be justified easily.

 

China is showing an expansionist attitude.  The territories of Taiwan, of Hong Kong, are not significant compared to the extent of mainland China.  Why cannot they be independent?  Why is China launching a dominance of the South China sea?  

 

In contrast, America has never been expansionist by force.  It pacifically BOUGHT some territories from other nations.  Having invaded Europe and gained control of Japan at the end of WWII,  it didn't make them colonies.   America prevailed over Iraq,  but it didn't take their oil.  This was only the idea of Trump.  The legal principles of America are pacific, but their leaders are not always so.  A decent American government will not try to colonize weaker nations and take away their resources.

.

The post was taken from a comment found in this video

 

Many people have no knowledge and respect for history. In the case of Singapore, we only to study Singapore and Malaysia history in secondary school. After that we don’t have to study history. So most Singaporeans don’t know world history. It’s very obvious when you read the posts of some posters here.

 

I (and some posters) have used historical facts to show you that China is not expansionist and US is the one that is a threat to global peace. The western media have ignored history and created much fake news to portray China as aggressive and expansionist.

 

I would love to hear some facts and evidence from you that don’t come from western fake media to revise my idea of how China is expansionist and US is not. 

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8 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Those who understand only ONE language, the one of their country of origin, have a void in their education.  This is the case with many Americans, and many Chinese.

 

A complete education should include at least two languages, and many westerners we speak multiple languages.  But they are usually western languages.  Mandarin is too difficult, too different a language for us to become proficient unless we have a real need.   And here is the issue of need:  it is more important for a Chinese, for a Japanese, for a Malaysian, for a Thai, for a South Korean to speak English,  than for an American to learn these eastern languages. 

 

In today's world, no language is inaccessible to anybody.  I could have understood your video had I taken the trouble to extract its audio and find a translator of voice.  My observation was about the failure to make the response to the interlocutor understandable to him,  in the common language English, or whatever language the other person understands. 

 

 

Thank you.

 

I understand how China has a different concept of "human rights" and some of its violations have been exaggerated by the Western press, and the West needs to accept them.  But there are other issues that cannot be justified easily.

 

China is showing an expansionist attitude.  The territories of Taiwan, of Hong Kong, are not significant compared to the extent of mainland China.  Why cannot they be independent?  Why is China launching a dominance of the South China sea?  

 

In contrast, America has never been expansionist by force.  It pacifically BOUGHT some territories from other nations.  Having invaded Europe and gained control of Japan at the end of WWII,  it didn't make them colonies.   America prevailed over Iraq,  but it didn't take their oil.  This was only the idea of Trump.  The legal principles of America are pacific, but their leaders are not always so.  A decent American government will not try to colonize weaker nations and take away their resources.

.

I am going to say once and for all how ignorant and disrespectful (to history) to say that China was expansionist in wanting to conquer Hong Kong. It just shows how successful the western (fake) media in twisting people’s minds. 
 

Hong Kong has always been part of China. 
 

it was the British who attacked China in opium war. Why? Cos China refused to let it sell opium to Chinese and make obscene profits while Chinese die from addiction. 
 

But China lost the war and Hong Kong was ceded to Britain.

 

Was the British interested in turning HK into a democracy. No. It was only interested in making money out of HK and China thru HK.

 

When it was time to return HK to China, that was when they started to plot against China by using HK as a pawn to cause trouble for China.

 

What China has done is to simply prevent the interference from the western powers to destabilise China through Hong Kong.

 

All this fight for democracy in HK is just a facade. How come they didnt fight for democracy when HK was still under UK? It only became fervent after it was returned to China. 

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When I started this thread, I only wanted to show the biggest fake news producer is the western media. Yes all countries including Singapore and China produce fake news. But the west being the greatest power now is the greatest news producer.

 

As the power shifts from the west to the east, the west media needs to create more fake news to prevent the shift. So it’s no surprise that China is now bashed most and also most misunderstood.

 

But like the saying goes, evil will never win righteousness. So in the end, China will return to supremacy. It’s GDP is expected to double in 15 years. 
 

Then someone here says I am garnering support for China. It will be hard to engage in any form of meaningful discussion with him/her. When someone chooses to stoop to getting personal, you know that they have no knowledge of history or evidence to back up what they want to say. They will end up doing name calling.

 

What I have written has nothing to do with I love China or not. I am merely laying down historical facts and current affairs (with the help of some posters here) and helping people to see beyond the fake news from the western media. 
 

Surely if you are going to have children you would want them to learn Chinese well. If you think of doing business you would want to do business in China. 

 

To get personal and say that China is evil so I will not speak Chinese or use made in China products is stupidity of the highest order.

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Why is knowledge of history so important? Cos history repeats itself and it doesn’t end.

 

Trump as US president is now history. But it was only just last year when we were still enjoying the antics and destruction (to US) done by him.

 

What Trump has done is to significantly weaken US as an economy and a political force. He was even considered a secret ally of China. 
 

Biden has inherited a weaker US from Trump and has work cut out for him. Apart from domestic affairs, he also has to contend with Russia and China at the same time.


The most unfortunate thing for Biden is that almost half of the US population believe that he stole the victory from Trump.

 

Trump is plotting to make a comeback in the next election. 
 

Given the current situation, it’s hard to see how Biden is going to be able to reverse the decline of the US. 

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I know i am going nonstop about this but take a closer look. It has a lot of significances and impact on future global politics.

 

(It’s very fun when you think of how politicians apply the art of war on negotiations. Yang did an amazing job here.)

 

It is the first time the whole world gets to see with their own eyes the confrontation between China and US. In this case the western media has little room for fake news as everyone can see for themselves as long as they have internet access.

 

And what do we see? A brash and confident China that does not play to the script of the US. A less confident and less sure US that turned from offensive to defensive in a matter of minutes.

 

If you don’t see that, please study the body language of the officials as well as the little things such as Sullivan passing a note to Blinken while Wang Yi was still talking. Or read the comments of some observant posters on YouTube.

 

China will actually become more popular on global political stage amongst the developing countries especially those bullied by the US. 

 

Those who hate China will hate it even more.

 

8 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

LOL!  I also think this meeting must have been interesting.  Maybe both parties in the talk telling each other what they didn't want to hear could be a good beginning.  Like what Putin said to Biden years ago "now we understand each other".   After American TRUMP insulted and belittled every other foreign leader,  these leaders are entitled now to come down to the Americans without reservations.  :lol: 

 

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