Friendship Destroyed by Act of Stupidity

[Steve5380]

2 hours ago, KENZ said:

 

Steve, you mean to say in your country it is perfectly fine to use a spy cam or hidden cam to video people when they are showering without their consent because it is just for our personal viewing pleasure (as long as no intention to victimize) ?!? Which country is that? 

 

No, I don't say that.  I am speaking about the incident reported by the TS.  He wrote: 

 

"  I did something foolish and use my dick instead of brain. So I tried to spy cam him when he was showering, so he saw the cam and he confronted me and things just went downhill then "  and later about his mentor: " he said my friend is not worth keeping as he couldn't take it as a prank and is too petty cause tbh I didn't see any part of him but he said he felt sexually assaulted."

 

He said that he TRIED to spy-cam but his friend saw the cam.  So it is not certain that HE DID spy-cam.  Also he didn't see any part of his friend, who said he felt "sexually assaulted".   This does not sound like a serious crime that warrants prosecution. 

 

[Steve5380]

1 hour ago, gc0805 said:

 

If you film people WITHOUT THEIR CONSENT, when they are bathing, or having sex or in other circumstances where they have every right to expect privacy, you will have committed a criminal act. Even in the west:

http://www.universityherald.com/articles/4001/20130725/csu-student-video-recording-men-showering-campus.htm

In Singapore, an NTU male student was recently arrested for videotaping another male student bathing. This was widely reported in our local Chinese newspapers. Perhaps your were not aware of it.

If found guilty, the CRIMINAL can expect jail sentences.

http://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/courts-crime/man-gets-8-weeks-jail-for-taking-videos-of-woman-in-shower

 

 

It depends on the circumstances.  

In your first example, that student did it to multiple men in a public place, which is more serious.

In your second example, even if it happened in a private home, the recording was consummated multiple times, an aggravating factor, and the filmed person of opposite gender was very upset by it.

 

In the case of the TS, two students of the same gender and age had an incident at home that did not result in a video being made.

No prosecutor of sane mind would try to make a criminal case out of that.  Not even in Singapore, I would think.   

[KENZ]

4 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

No, I don't say that.  I am speaking about the incident reported by the TS.  He wrote: 

 

"  I did something foolish and use my dick instead of brain. So I tried to spy cam him when he was showering, so he saw the cam and he confronted me and things just went downhill then "  and later about his mentor: " he said my friend is not worth keeping as he couldn't take it as a prank and is too petty cause tbh I didn't see any part of him but he said he felt sexually assaulted."

 

He said that he TRIED to spy-cam but his friend saw the cam.  So it is not certain that HE DID spy-cam.  Also he didn't see any part of his friend, who said he felt "sexually assaulted".   This does not sound like a serious crime that warrants prosecution. 

 

Ok Steve I do see where you are coming from in terms of having concrete evidences. Moral issues aside.

However obviously in this instance we all know the intention of TS to spy cam his friend because he is horny. but to be honest it will be extremely difficult for TS to defend his own action for bringing in a cam to the shower area and pointing it at his friend While showering.

The very act of bringing in a recording device and aiming it at a naked showering person by virtue of implied intention is not so easy to just brush it off as just a prank. 

[Steve5380]

1 hour ago, KENZ said:

Ok Steve I do see where you are coming from in terms of having concrete evidences. Moral issues aside.

However obviously in this instance we all know the intention of TS to spy cam his friend because he is horny. but to be honest it will be extremely difficult for TS to defend his own action for bringing in a cam to the shower area and pointing it at his friend While showering.

The very act of bringing in a recording device and aiming it at a naked showering person by virtue of implied intention is not so easy to just brush it off as just a prank. 

 

I agree.  He did something wrong, out of stupidity and inexperience.  And he seems to have paid a good price for that already.  It was not brushed off as just a prank by the persons he cares about.  And he recognizes all of the above.  So does it make sense that we pound on him some more?  

 

The slightest reflection leads to the conclusion that it is not worth to surreptitiously record a real person in a compromising intimate state.  There is enough free porn that covers all the possible fantasies we like to satisfy.  What is the point?  Did the TS think that his friend's cock was any different from the billions of others in this world?   What is important is that the TS realizes this and never does something like that again.

 

[Guest Guest]

7 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

No, I don't say that.  I am speaking about the incident reported by the TS.  He wrote: 

 

"  I did something foolish and use my dick instead of brain. So I tried to spy cam him when he was showering, so he saw the cam and he confronted me and things just went downhill then "  and later about his mentor: " he said my friend is not worth keeping as he couldn't take it as a prank and is too petty cause tbh I didn't see any part of him but he said he felt sexually assaulted."

 

He said that he TRIED to spy-cam but his friend saw the cam.  So it is not certain that HE DID spy-cam.  Also he didn't see any part of his friend, who said he felt "sexually assaulted".   This does not sound like a serious crime that warrants prosecution. 

 

How about a person TRIED to murder you but at the end didn't ..and claimed it as a PRANK

[Guest Guest]

10 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

If there was no injury to the offended party, to his friend ("injury" meaning anything that victimized him), then... where is that "severity" in the TS actions, where is his criminality? For a CRIME to have been committed, there has to be a VICTIM.  And in a more refined context, there has to be INTENTION to victimize.

Woah, bringing a video cam with to film someone showering without his consent ..

 

Couldnt you see the VICTIM, INTENTIONS and CRIME here...??.even a 12 years old can tell.

 

it is interesting that u bring up the Catholic Church. Your arguments here remind me of how the church and popes try to white wash pedophile priests.

[Steve5380]

9 minutes ago, Guest Guest said:

How about a person TRIED to murder you but at the end didn't ..and claimed it as a PRANK

 

Then I would wish so much that the person had just TRIED to spy cam me while taking a bath... for a prank!

[Guest Guest]

1 hour ago, Steve5380 said:

 

I agree.  He did something wrong, out of stupidity and INEXPERIENCE.  And he seems to have paid a good price for that already.  It was not brushed off as just a prank by the persons he cares about.  And he recognizes all of the above.  So does it make sense that we pound on him some more?  

 

 

Yeah may be he should gain more experience and learn a trick of two how to SPYCAM someone without being detected

[Steve5380]

5 minutes ago, Guest Guest said:

Woah, bringing a video cam with to film someone showering without his consent ..

Couldnt you see the VICTIM, INTENTIONS and CRIME here...??.even a 12 years old can tell.

it is interesting that u bring up the Catholic Church. Your arguments here remind me of how the church and popes try to white wash pedophile priests.

 

even a 12 years old can tell?  You are giving them too much maturity!

 

Compare the situation of a priest in the Catholic church sexually abusing a 12 year old altar boy, with the case of the TS trying to film a fellow adult college student taking a bath!

Do you have any sense of proportion?

And this adult "friend" claiming to feel "sexually assaulted"??!!  This is something for a virgin teenage girl to feel,  not an adult guy with plenty of pubic hair and a far from virgin dick to protect.   

[Guest Guest]

7 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

It depends on the circumstances.  

In your first example, that student did it to multiple men in a public place, which is more serious.

In your second example, even if it happened in a private home, the recording was consummated multiple times, an aggravating factor, and the filmed person of opposite gender was very upset by it.

 

In the case of the TS, two students of the same gender and age had an incident at home that did not result in a video being made.

No prosecutor of sane mind would try to make a criminal case out of that.  Not even in Singapore, I would think.   

More serious less serious..wrong is still wrong..

 

I hope you are right otherwise don't leave wrong message to the impressionable ones here

[Guest Guest]

6 minutes ago, Steve5380 said:

 

even a 12 years old can tell?  You are giving them too much maturity!

 

Compare the situation of a priest in the Catholic church sexually abusing a 12 year old altar boy, with the case of the TS trying to film a fellow adult college student taking a bath!

Do you have any sense of proportion?

And this adult "friend" claiming to feel "sexually assaulted"??!!  This is something for a virgin teenage girl to feel,  not an adult guy with plenty of pubic hair and a far from virgin dick to protect.   

Woah who say men cannot have emotions or feel emotionally threatened or insulted..that's a sexists macho men culture

[Guest Queen Khong]

I will be so disgusted and traumatised if a straight girl filmed me. Don't be an asshole please.

 

He is a smaller asshole for confusing you. Maybe he is gay, bi or confused. But he didn't break the law. You are at the losing end.

[KENZ]

2 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

I agree.  He did something wrong, out of stupidity and inexperience.  And he seems to have paid a good price for that already.  It was not brushed off as just a prank by the persons he cares about.  And he recognizes all of the above.  So does it make sense that we pound on him some more?  

 

The slightest reflection leads to the conclusion that it is not worth to surreptitiously record a real person in a compromising intimate state.  There is enough free porn that covers all the possible fantasies we like to satisfy.  What is the point?  Did the TS think that his friend's cock was any different from the billions of others in this world?   What is important is that the TS realizes this and never does something like that again.

 

Thank you Steve for your reply.

Don't worry I have no intention of pounding TS. In fact I have been in contact with him through watsapp these few days to show him some support, given that this backlash may be too much for a young man to handle by himself.

I asked you because I felt that your initial post was somewhat misleading and I wanted to clear up any misunderstanding in case others get the wrong information. 

[Guest Guest]

5 hours ago, KENZ said:

Thank you Steve for your reply.

Don't worry I have no intention of pounding TS. In fact I have been in contact with him through watsapp these few days to show him some support, given that this backlash may be too much for a young man to handle by himself.

I asked you because I felt that your initial post was somewhat misleading and I wanted to clear up any misunderstanding in case others get the wrong information. 

 

How did TS appear? Remorseful or?

[KENZ]

55 minutes ago, Guest Guest said:

 

How did TS appear? Remorseful or?

Guest, the conversation between TS and me is Private and confidential.

All I can say is Yes he is indeed remorseful and wish he never did it and promises never to do it again.

This is a very good lesson for all of us, young and old alike to think twice should we be tempted to do such a thing, as the repercussions can be more than we can handle.

[Steve5380]

1 hour ago, KENZ said:

This is a very good lesson for all of us, young and old alike to think twice should we be tempted to do such a thing, as the repercussions can be more than we can handle.

 

Good advice.  There are better ways to handle oneself when balls overheat for some guy.

 

TS said that his friend knew that he is gay, and he was fine with this.  So TS only needed a little more courage to ask his friend if he could help washing him while he took his shower, and if accepted, doing it such that the friend got a nice hard on. And then ask the question if he liked to have it sucked too.  

 

This is not so far off.  A straight guy should not be so shy about getting such "help", especially if the TS is cute and not very masculine, and we gays do it much better than any girl. I would not have a problem if a girl wants to do this to me.  Of course, I am more open-minded than an adult guy who feels "sexually assaulted" by a friend who tries to film him...,  and I would always go for mutual satisfaction instead of mutual conflict!

[Dracula]

For TS:
All i can think of for you to do is to keep doing favours for that friend, and keep apologizing when this spycam memory resurface again.
And don't forget, you are also entitled to move on and make a new best friend.

 

6 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

This is not so far off.  A straight guy should not be so shy about getting such "help", especially if the TS is cute and not very masculine, and we gays do it much better than any girl. I would not have a problem if a girl wants to do this to me.  Of course, I am more open-minded than an adult guy who feels "sexually assaulted" by a friend who tries to film him...,  and I would always go for mutual satisfaction instead of mutual conflict!

 

For Steve:

Please do not try to fit in everything according to your wisdom. (This is for our own sake to avoid arrogant mistake in the future).
The friend's reaction was natural. Even if TS failed recording at that time, the friend would still assume that TS could've ever spycammed him successfully in the past more than once or twice. Given that there are so many spyvids of guys (showing face) being spread in internet, the friend also cannot feel 100% safe, even after he confronted TS (maybe in the attempt to prevent TS from spreading it). Also note that the friend confronted TS calmly, so he was being open-minded and not creating any conflict (conflicts are not mutual). Bottomline, any attempt to spycam someone else's privacy (worse, when in shower) without authoritative consent is a crime. So please Steve, in case similar thing happens nearby you, do not judge the friend.

 

For all other guests:
From the tone when writing this thread, TS sounds regretful and mentions that he meant no harm. His writing also implied that it was his first time trying to spycam someone else, so i think all the other anonymous guests now could stop condemning him (perhaps for your stress venting).

 

For KENZ:
Thankfully that there is you here among us who willingly took initiative to help TS. After reading your posts, I'm sure you would be able to provide well-thought opinions to TS, and to prevent him from doing stupid things or making the problem worse with his friend.

 

Edited July 24, 2016 by Dracula
incomplete post

[Steve5380]

5 hours ago, Dracula said:

For Steve:

Please do not try to fit in everything according to your wisdom. (This is for our own sake to avoid arrogant mistake in the future).
The friend's reaction was natural. Even if TS failed recording at that time, the friend would still assume that TS could've ever spycammed him successfully in the past more than once or twice. Given that there are so many spyvids of guys (showing face) being spread in internet, the friend also cannot feel 100% safe, even after he confronted TS (maybe in the attempt to prevent TS from spreading it). Also note that the friend confronted TS calmly, so he was being open-minded and not creating any conflict (conflicts are not mutual). Bottomline, any attempt to spycam someone else's privacy (worse, when in shower) without authoritative consent is a crime. So please Steve, in case similar thing happens nearby you, do not judge the friend.

 

For Dracula:

You are doing exactly what you criticize me of doing, that is, fitting everything so neatly according to what is in your mind.

I'm not trying to trivialize the incident so that others think that they can do it without problems. The action of TS was dumb, dumb, dumb, not because he is necessarily a dumb person but because of ignorance and inexperience.  My point here is that we should not rush to judge so harshly. 

 

Yes, many people would have reacted like the TS' friend did.  This does not mean that it was ideal.  YOU speculate that he may be afraid that he was recorded before, but, again from the details of this particular episode,  he discovered the spy cam so easily that it shows a poor spying work by the TS.  So he can be confident that he would have found it earlier too. One thing in his favor is that he confronted TS calmly. But then he should have accepted TS' apology and not made such a big deal out of it but promised to make it a very serious issue including perhaps filing charges if TS attempted it again.

 

If this 'friend' is any smart, he will not fear, as you think, to be recorded again. Any of us, if we suspect that someone wants to film us while taking a shower or elsewhere in the nude, we can check that no recording device is around, unless we live with a secret agent of the CIA, KGB, Mossad. 

 

If this 'friend' is reasonable, adult, open minded, he should not have accused TS of making him feel "sexually assaulted".

This "sexual assault" makes no sense.  An ASSAULT is a PHYSICAL ATTACK  (check in the dictionary).

All what happened physically to the 'friend' is that visible light scattered from his body, like it does from every object,  and some of this light was captured by a video camera. Nothing painful    All the rest that happened took place in his mind and in the mind of the TS.  

 

This does not mean that the incident was trivial,  but that one has to be reasonable and not jump immediately to the denouncing of a crime. 

Edited July 24, 2016 by Steve5380

[Guest Guest]

For Steve5380

[MeowPrince]

On 24/07/2016 at 8:05 AM, KENZ said:

The very act of bringing in a recording device and aiming it at a naked showering person by virtue of implied intention is not so easy to just brush it off as just a prank. 

 

Kudos to you, for having reached out, and giving him some advice.

Since he is, as you have shared, feeling remorse for his action, then it is time to move on and put this matter behind.  I am sure many (if not all) of us have done something bad sometime in our lives.  To be able to recognise it and feel honest remorse is half the step forward (and not everyone can even go that far!).  Next will be to move on.  If moving on means making amends where he can, then he should do so.  If it means letting go after he has done what he has to, then let go.  

 

While I do wish you and he all the best, please emphasize to him the fact that what he did cannot ever be condone, whether the target is gay or nay.  It cannot be ever interpreted as a prank either.  That is something that is simply no go in both Sg and Asian societies, and still a morally wrong thing in most other places.  In fact, caution him NOT to keep anyone who'd suggest such a notion at all - that person cannot be a good friend or mentor to have.

All the best!


As it seems the thread and discussion has mostly run its course, perhaps the mods can close this thread too.  

[Steve5380]

1 hour ago, Guest Guest said:

For Steve5380

 

It would help if you explain why you are shaking your head like that.

[Steve5380]

40 minutes ago, MeowPrince said:

 

Kudos to you, for having reached out, and giving him some advice.

Since he is, as you have shared, feeling remorse for his action, then it is time to move on and put this matter behind.  I am sure many (if not all) of us have done something bad sometime in our lives.  To be able to recognise it and feel honest remorse is half the step forward (and not everyone can even go that far!).  Next will be to move on.  If moving on means making amends where he can, then he should do so.  If it means letting go after he has done what he has to, then let go.  

 

While I do wish you and he all the best, please emphasize to him the fact that what he did cannot ever be condone, whether the target is gay or nay.  It cannot be ever interpreted as a prank either.  That is something that is simply no go in both Sg and Asian societies, and still a morally wrong thing in most other places.  In fact, caution him NOT to keep anyone who'd suggest such a notion at all - that person cannot be a good friend or mentor to have.

All the best!

 

As it seems the thread and discussion has mostly run its course, perhaps the mods can close this thread too.  

 

Your post is quite negative.  You imply that to tell him for the Nth time that what he did is wrong and he should feel remorse and should move on is all the "support" he needs.  I don't see any support in this.  It is pure PREACHING down from some high horse.   And you go further and have the nerve to tell someone else to emphasize to him that what he did cannot ever be condoned.  You didn't recognize from the very first post of TS that he does not need any more condemnation and what your preaching just rubs in his mistake even more?

 

And like the alleged 'friend' of the TS you fail to see how the episode has hurt the perpetrator, according his post.  If a person starts a fight with another, and as result gets beaten very badly, the help should go to the badly beaten, even if he was the perpetrator.  At least this is in the spirit of Christianity and other advanced moralities.  Is this so difficult to comprehend by an Asian mentality? I rather think that you have a cultural block.  And perhaps some arrogant sanctimoniousness.

 

Apparently the episode we are discussing was the first incident of its nature between the two.  What happened as consequence would have been right if the two were strangers. But they were FRIENDS living together in a foreign land for a joint purpose.  The alleged 'friend' treated the TS like he was a broken and therefore worthless piece of junk that had to be discarded, instead of a friend who made an embarrassing mistake and did everything possible to apologize and amend.     

[Guest Guest]

3 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

It would help if you explain why you are shaking your head like that.

[Guest 包沈 not shane pow]

Bottom line: some ang mohs like steve feel flattered to be filmed naked, don't mind if it gets spread online. 

 

Asians may have cultural block and arrogant sanctimoniousness many of the times, but most of us are afraid of our naked photos and videos being spread online and viewed and discussed by strangers and friends alike.

 

Unless the mentor of that friend is an ang moh like steve, i suspect he is just irresponsible and values his friendship with TS more than his decency and personal safety.

 

With such a mentor around, it is unsurprising most here are quick to condemn TS's actions. Some of us may be, ironically, genuinely concerned about him, as opposed to his mentor.

 

Ps: after the AWARE inccident, "mentor" now is almost a dirty word with an ugly ring to it.

 

 

[KENZ]

Thank you guys for the affirmation but to be honest, there is not much i could do except to lend him my listening ear and give some advice, as the ball is in other people's court.

Neither did i harp on the wrongful action as by now he is well aware and remorseful about it.

 

For the benefit of those going through similar situation, here is the gist of some damage control solution i shared. 

1) Apologize sincerely (do what it takes to proof your sincerity) 

2) Lay Low ( Don't draw anymore unnecessary attention to yourself, especially when the other party's emotion is still raw)

3) Avoid being confrontational or to defend your position ( given that you are already in the wrong, don't irritate the other party further)

4) Whether friendship can be mended or not, you can only wait for the other party to take the first step. (The ball is in his courts, how long it takes or if this friendship is worth keeping is really up to him.)

 

Most importantly Learn the lesson, move on from it, forgive yourself and don't repeat this mistake ever in this life again. 

[Guest virginal]

I was writing some angry words to the TS, but I decided not to when I realised I myself had been guilty of the same.

 

I have had several close str8 friends over the years, and it just seemed natural or unavoidable for me to develop feelings that were more than just platonic. I was always aware that they were straight and happy that way. They knew about me being gay and were cool about it, some of them would get naked when showering together after our sports, knowing I'd check them out but still cool with it. But when I got a little more cheeky and touchy, they'd tell me not to because it made them uncomfortable. Whenever those warnings were given, however gently, I always felt guilt, that I had betrayed their trust and our friendship, and our friendship had developed a crack.

 

Sadly, for a few, that crack never mended. My experience of lost friendships have got me rethinking if I had ever seen them as friends, or had I seen them as sexual objects from the start. I still have good friends who are str8 and who I find sexually attractive. While I still sometimes fantasized about them, I would not endanger our friendship, because I find they are very genuine in ours. I don't want to be the opportunist and take advantage of their trust.

 

To stop myself, sometimes I would recall those guys who I'm friends with, who are absolutely not my type (imagine yours), attempting to molest me, or harbouring thoughts of taking advantage of me sexually when I am drunk or somthing, I would feel really grossed out, sick, hurt and betrayed, and I would feel sick every time I see that guy. If our friendship mends, I would still never fully trust that friend ever again. And I think about how my friend would feel if I were to do that to him. Then I'd be that sicko who perverted our friendship and my trust.

 

If your friendship with this guy mends in any way, you would be very lucky. Either way, you had been served a great lesson on friendship. It was brave of you to admit what you had done, so I believe you will survive and do much better after this episode.

[Guest Guest Anonnnnn]

Hi all, I am the TS and I have read the post and thanks for the contributions. I know I have done a grave mistake and if I could turn back time I definitely will not want to commit this error and spoil a friendship. It has been hard for me and I have been withdrawing from people. KENZ has been lending his ear and giving me advise. 

 

I truly regret my mistake and I know no words could express how deeply sorry I am and I hope the dust will settle soon. 

 

To moderator I hope you could please close this tread thank you. 

[Guest :-(]

TS, can share the video? Thanks

[Guest guest]

2 minutes ago, Guest :-( said:

TS, can share the video? Thanks

Are u trying to stir shit? 

[Steve5380]

9 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

 

Here you react like you just saw me showering nude...  Too bad I prefer Asian men!

[Guest Guest]

1 hour ago, Steve5380 said:

Here you react like you just saw me showering nude...  Too bad I prefer Asian men!

 

[gc0805]

14 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Your post is quite negative.  You imply that to tell him for the Nth time that what he did is wrong and he should feel remorse and should move on is all the "support" he needs.  I don't see any support in this.  It is pure PREACHING down from some high horse.   And you go further and have the nerve to tell someone else to emphasize to him that what he did cannot ever be condoned.  You didn't recognize from the very first post of TS that he does not need any more condemnation and what your preaching just rubs in his mistake even more?

 

And like the alleged 'friend' of the TS you fail to see how the episode has hurt the perpetrator, according his post.  If a person starts a fight with another, and as result gets beaten very badly, the help should go to the badly beaten, even if he was the perpetrator.  At least this is in the spirit of Christianity and other advanced moralities.  Is this so difficult to comprehend by an Asian mentality? I rather think that you have a cultural block.  And perhaps some arrogant sanctimoniousness.

 

Apparently the episode we are discussing was the first incident of its nature between the two.  What happened as consequence would have been right if the two were strangers. But they were FRIENDS living together in a foreign land for a joint purpose.  The alleged 'friend' treated the TS like he was a broken and therefore worthless piece of junk that had to be discarded, instead of a friend who made an embarrassing mistake and did everything possible to apologize and amend.     

 

Steve commented that Meow Prince's post is negative.

I could not DISAGREE with Steve more.

I find Meow Prince's post fair, balanced, courteous and even encouraging. I couldn't find anything negative about it at all.

In fact, if we really want to read a negative post, we should refer back to Steve's initial post on the 23/7 where he vilified the innocent victim, calling him "an idiot or a very inexperienced righteous fuck".

I think I speak for many of the contributors to this thread, by concluding that

1) the thread has run its course, so it's time to close it and move on, and we hope that TS moves on as well

2) Steve is the one who needs counselling

Cheers and goodnight.

 

 

Edited July 25, 2016 by gc0805

[Guest Fuwar]

Thanks Kenz. We need more like you in the community. 

 

Steve, this thread is not about you.

 

Can we close this thread as the TS request? Thank you.

[Guest Guest]

I guess Steve doesn't realize that most of the "negative" posts are triggered by his own posts trying to trivialize the matter and vilify the victim with his half baked logic and assumptions.

 

he has in a way rubbed more salt in the wound.

 

 

[Steve5380]

13 minutes ago, gc0805 said:

 

I could not DISAGREE with Steve more.

I find Meow Prince's post fair, balanced, courteous and even encouraging. I couldn't find anything negative about it at all.

In fact, if we really want to read a negative post, we should refer back to Steve's initial post on the 23/7 where he vilified the innocent victim, calling him "an idiot or a very inexperienced righteous fuck".

I think I speak for many of the contributors to this thread, by concluding that

1) the thread has run its course, so it's time to close it and move on, and we hope that TS moves on as well

2) Steve is the one who needs counselling

Cheers and goodnight.

 

LOL!  You could not disagree MORE...  I "vilified the innocent victim" ???

 

Don't pretend to speak for anyone but yourself.  God (!) save me and others from your kind of counseling. 

I am really surprised by the pettiness of your opinion and others like you.  Maybe it is cultural.

This brings to mind the pettiness of making the throwing out of chewing gum a CRIME.

 

We all remember the case of the violin student Clementi in the US who was surreptitiously filmed by a roommate having sex with a guy, 

and who committed suicide the next day by jumping from a bridge, after seeing the video made public.  THIS WAS A SERIOUS, CRIMINAL CASE.

 

In the TS episode,  your "innocent victim" is a victim because you want to make him one.

In my estimation, the biggest victim was the TS (victim of himself), and the "friend" did not qualify as a friend, and he may get the bad karma.

 

 

[Guest Guest]

Steve are you sure you are not trolling TS?

 

 

[Steve5380]

1 hour ago, Guest Guest said:

Steve are you sure you are not trolling TS?

 

Yes, absolutely sure.  I don't troll anybody.  I simply express and justify my opinions, and nobody is forced to accept them.

 

Now, GuestGuest... who would try to remain so anonymous like you if it is not... for TROLLING?

 

I second TS's request to close this thread to let him put the issue to rest, to save the well intentioned to repeat ourselves, and also saving us all from your trolling.

Edited July 25, 2016 by Steve5380

[Guest Duh]

This is not US.

Don't push US opinions on us.

Thread shld close.

[Steve5380]

2 hours ago, Guest Duh said:

This is not US.

Don't push US opinions on us.

Thread shld close.

 

This is not us

Don't push us opinions on US

 

US us US us US us US us US us

us US us US us US us US us US

US us US us US us US us US us

us US us US us US us US us US

US us US us US us US us US us

us US us US us US us US us US

 

[Guest Guest]

14 minutes ago, Steve5380 said:

 

This is not us

Don't push us opinions on US

 

US us US us US us US us US us

us US us US us US us US us US

US us US us US us US us US us

us US us US us US us US us US

US us US us US us US us US us

us US us US us US us US us US

 

 

 

the hell...? 

[Guest Guest]

7 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

 

Yes, absolutely sure.  I don't troll anybody.  I simply express and justify my opinions, and nobody is forced to accept them.

 

Now, GuestGuest... who would try to remain so anonymous like you if it is not... for TROLLING?

 

I second TS's request to close this thread to let him put the issue to rest, to save the well intentioned to repeat ourselves, and also saving us all from your trolling.

Haha ok ok..cos your posts seem like using reverse psychology to make TS feeling even worse and feeling more guilty when you condemn the victim and wishing bad karma on him

[Steve5380]

9 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

 

 

the hell...? 

 

Us in the US write it "what".  Isn't this how the Queen of England writes it too?

[Steve5380]

9 hours ago, Guest Guest said:

Haha ok ok..cos your posts seem like using reverse psychology to make TS feeling even worse and feeling more guilty when you condemn the victim and wishing bad karma on him

 

I don't use reverse psychology, you must be twisting my words.

I don't wish anyone bad karma.  There is not much bad karma here,

but if any goes around, I think the "friend" will get the bigger slice.

[Guest Glyph]

Thread closed.