The pandemic has virtually killed gay life in Thailand

[InBangkok]

13 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

Ah, and not to forget... to travel back to BKK and perhaps Pattaya to keep exploring gay life there, and perhaps making a stop in SG to meet gays there.

You might have to forego Bangkok and Pattaya. The pandemic has virtually killed gay life in Pattaya. Sunee Plaza is on life support with just 2 bars active and many up for sale. Boyztown is heading there fast. If you read the sawatdee gay chat room entries which are written largely by expats living in Pattaya and tourists who visit quite regularly - https://sawatdeenetwork.com/v4/forum.php - the only area with any life is Jomtien Plaza. There are no gay bars or saunas there - only beer bars which are staffed mostly with Lao, Vietnamese and Cambodian boys. It appears most of the Thais who used to work on the sex scene have given up and returned home. This who remain are dependent on the apps, but these are not much help if you want to see guys in person in bars and saunas.

 

With Thailand now going through its third and by far the worst wave of the pandemic, and with some in the media suggesting it is now out of control, many entertainment venues in Bangkok are again closed - some for good. Bar owners cannot keep paying rent on premises in relatively expensive parts of the city with no income coming in. When Soi Twilight closed for good, the bars which moved to the Patpong Soi 2 area all cost quite a bit to refurbish. I cannot believe even a fraction of these costs have yet been recouped. 

 

Re saunas, it's not just Babylon that is dead. One thread on the sawatdeenetwork mentions that some saunas which had proliferated in the outskirts of the city have also died. The only soi that remains semi-active is Silom Soi 4. Even there, though, the "for sale" signs are going up.

 

Taipei would have been a better alternative, but after 253 days without any cases, it now has a largish cluster of cases. Although it closed its borders back in March last year allowing in only returnees, a few months ago it cut the quarantine period for pilots on its international airlines to just 3 days. And it is flight crews that are responsible for having brought the virus back into the country. Just yesterday the government announced the indefinite closure of all entertainment venues, these to include bars, saunas, nightclubs, sports centres and others.

 

South East Asia is also suffering as a result of desperately slow vaccine roll outs. Thailand is manufacturing its own version of the Astra-Zeneca vaccine but the vaccination programme does not start until June. In summary tourism, whether generally or for sex,  in much of Asia, already on life support, is unlikely to pick up for at least another year.

[Steve5380]

8 hours ago, InBangkok said:

You might have to forego Bangkok and Pattaya. The pandemic has virtually killed gay life in Pattaya. Sunee Plaza is on life support with just 2 bars active and many up for sale. Boyztown is heading there fast. If you read the sawatdee gay chat room entries which are written largely by expats living in Pattaya and tourists who visit quite regularly - https://sawatdeenetwork.com/v4/forum.php - the only area with any life is Jomtien Plaza. There are no gay bars or saunas there - only beer bars which are staffed mostly with Lao, Vietnamese and Cambodian boys. It appears most of the Thais who used to work on the sex scene have given up and returned home. This who remain are dependent on the apps, but these are not much help if you want to see guys in person in bars and saunas.

 

With Thailand now going through its third and by far the worst wave of the pandemic, and with some in the media suggesting it is now out of control, many entertainment venues in Bangkok are again closed - some for good. Bar owners cannot keep paying rent on premises in relatively expensive parts of the city with no income coming in. When Soi Twilight closed for good, the bars which moved to the Patpong Soi 2 area all cost quite a bit to refurbish. I cannot believe even a fraction of these costs have yet been recouped. 

 

 

Thank you for the information.  The outlook in Thailand is quite bleak. The only hope now is for a resurgence after the pandemic is over.  I checked at the Babylon Facebook that they have closed indefinitely, but I got no information about its land, if they have torn down the installations. I have emotional ties to this place and his prospect hurts me more than the fire at Notre Dame in Paris!

 

41 minutes ago, Guest Just Relax said:

That is a lot of territories to cover at the age of 78 and you do know that time flies with a blink of an eye.  You are giving yourself a lot of pressure. 

 

Yes, I experience that time flies away at an ever faster rate.  But what I listed are merely the plans.  And I accept changes in plans as circumstances may require.  I have been given myself pressure all my life, and it is now a habit easy to tolerate. And one can learn to relax under some pressure.  May I add that it is important for gay life after 40 years old to have some plans for the future that are desirable goals, instead of thinking that it will be soon "too late" for everything.

[Guest Moonlight Stories]

1 hour ago, Steve5380 said:

 

May I add that it is important for gay life after 40 years old to have some plans for the future that are desirable goals, instead of thinking that it will be soon "too late" for everything.

I plan to write a book - Animal Farm (Part 2) with bigger stories and more characters, one of whom is an agile gay Squirrel never before mentioned in Part 1.   This time, the pig can actually fly and they allowed the donkeys to walk on two legs too.  It is good to write books when one has gained sufficient human experiences after 40 years.  There will be 7 books in total, based on real life stories packful of adventures, deceit, hero and mysteries, happened at the backdrop of a jungle surrounded by the seas.

[Steve5380]

14 minutes ago, Guest Moonlight Stories said:

I plan to write a book - Animal Farm (Part 2) with bigger stories and more characters, one of whom is an agile gay Squirrel never before mentioned in Part 1.   This time, the pig can actually fly and they allowed the donkeys to walk on two legs too.  It is good to write books when one has gained sufficient human experiences after 40 years.  There will be 7 books in total, based on real life stories packful of adventures, deceit, hero and mysteries, happened at the backdrop of a jungle surrounded by the seas.

 

I like your ideas.  After all, we are nothing more than another species of animals.

[InBangkok]

14 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

I checked at the Babylon Facebook that they have closed indefinitely, but I got no information about its land, if they have torn down the installations

We sometimes visit friends in the Sukhothai Residences and the taxi has to stop for a few moments as the entrance gate is right by Babylon. Although that area is quite dark, it is clear the building still exists and there is no indication of demolition.

[Steve5380]

9 minutes ago, InBangkok said:

We sometimes visit friends in the Sukhothai Residences and the taxi has to stop for a few moments as the entrance gate is right by Babylon. Although that area is quite dark, it is clear the building still exists and there is no indication of demolition.

 

Thank you again.  This leaves me hope that once the gay scene in BKK resurges again,  Babylon may reopen with the same or a different owner.  I think this makes sense since the name, the prestige and base of customers of this place should add to its value.

[InBangkok]

5 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

This leaves me hope that once the gay scene in BKK resurges again,  Babylon may reopen with the same or a different owner.  I think this makes sense since the name, the prestige and base of customers of this place should add to its value.

With all respect, no one is going to buy it to reopen as a sauna. The value of the land alone in that location is far too high. How could any potential buyer of a 2 or 3 storey sauna - and the larger 7 storey section that I believe houses The Barracks - compete with a major land developer ready to put up billions of baht to purchase the entire plot (which includes more than just the Babylon complex area)? This is even more true when the sauna entrance fees barely cover staff, F&B, administration and maintenance costs. 

 

According to sawatdeenetwork and other Thai chat rooms, the customer base has been falling for some years. There are fewer Thais with more money boys amongst them. The local expat community has aged and go less frequently, if at all.  The foreigner tourists hoping to meet up with locals are often disappointed. Before the pandemic, many better-off younger to middle-aged Thais who were Babylon's original customer base seemed to prefer to go clubbing, and foreign tourists now use the apps. I believe South East Asians became more regular patrons but the pandemic has killed that market at least until somewhere around mid-next year by which time all Thais should be vaccinated.

 

Babylon had a stunning 12 year run in its old premises at the top of the soi and another 15 or so in the new location. It was one man's dream project. It must have been very difficult for the owner to watch the customer base fall away. On the other hand, he is getting no younger and a future elsewhere in Chiang Mai must seem a desirable next chapter in his life.

 

Besides, the demise of Soi Twilight to the wreckers ball 2 years ago has become almost a metaphor for what will happen to the main gay entertainment businesses in Bangkok once the pandemic is over. The Thai elite have long wanted to get rid of Bangkok's image as the sex capital of Asia. It seems they are prepared to tolerate girlie bars, but not the gay scene. Many popular gay establishments have died over the last 5 years or so. Examples include the massage spas Hero, Fan Club, Aqua and Albury - all established for more than ten years, offered great service and were in great central locations.

 

Perhaps Chiang Mai offers an even better example. Over the last 5 or so years more than 50 gay establishments have shut up shop. 

Edited May 16, 2021 by InBangkok

[Steve5380]

The decimation of the gay scene in Thailand is very sad.  But we gays are not dying out, and demand will return.  The demise of these places in favor of apps has been predicted for many years, but did not happen.  Maybe the saunas have still something 'extra'?...   The essence of Babylon sauna/barracks is only a fraction of the lot, to the right of the entrance driveway.  It is not unreasonable to think that the lot can be divided and Babylon be left intact.  After so many years, the original owner may not like to have his dream project destroyed...  Will see!

 

The experiences of older gays in saunas and the gay scene in BKK should be welcomed by those who want to know how gay life can be after 40 y.o.  Unless... unless they plan to submit to sex reassignment therapy and become straights!   

[Guest Right?]

On 5/15/2021 at 8:44 PM, Steve5380 said:

 

I checked at the Babylon Facebook that they have closed indefinitely, but I got no information about its land, if they have torn down the installations. I have emotional ties to this place and his prospect hurts me more than the fire at Notre Dame in Paris!

 

You are going to hurt many Perisian's sensitive feelings.  Babylon may not be there, but you never know how many more gay suanas remained unexplored and still dotted around many Asian cities (Thai, Japan, Taiwan, Singapore, Phillipine. Vietnam, Korea, China?)  Life after 40, is the right age to start travelling and explore many hidden "Gem and Treasures" and soon Babylon may pale miserably to your new findings, right?  While Notre Dame may take decades to be back on its feet, you can start getting on with your feet first, right?

[InBangkok]

12 hours ago, Steve5380 said:

The decimation of the gay scene in Thailand is very sad.  But we gays are not dying out, and demand will return.  The demise of these places in favor of apps has been predicted for many years, but did not happen.  Maybe the saunas have still something 'extra'?...   The essence of Babylon sauna/barracks is only a fraction of the lot, to the right of the entrance driveway.  It is not unreasonable to think that the lot can be divided and Babylon be left intact.  After so many years, the original owner may not like to have his dream project destroyed...  Will see!

I fear your thinking does not take reality into account. Subdividing that lot into several separate units vastly reduces the overall land value. There are very few plots of that size in the city centre and demand for hugely expensive high-end apartments remains very high.  

 

The demise of Bangkok's gay scene has not in fact been predicted for "many years". Indeed, with the more recent wave of interest from Chinese tourists and from other Asian nations, until recently the thought was that this would keep demand at a reasonable level. Not as high as at its peak but still enough to keep businesses financially viable. But since the local Thais departed the bar scene, with the western gay tourist market on the decline for some years, and now covid19, the death knell is ringing louder than ever. I believe @Guest Right is correct. Other countries are becoming more attractive for the gay traveller.

[Steve5380]

1 hour ago, Guest Right? said:

You are going to hurt many Perisian's sensitive feelings.  Babylon may not be there, but you never know how many more gay suanas remained unexplored and still dotted around many Asian cities (Thai, Japan, Taiwan, Singapore, Phillipine. Vietnam, Korea, China?)  Life after 40, is the right age to start travelling and explore many hidden "Gem and Treasures" and soon Babylon may pale miserably to your new findings, right?  While Notre Dame may take decades to be back on its feet, you can start getting on with your feet first, right?

 

Some 16 years ago I started exploring "hidden gems and treasures" in about 10 different  Asian cities,  and most of them paled to Babylon.  It is not for nothing that I like the latter.   I feel bad about the accident at Notre Dame, I had years ago climbed to the top of one of its towers, and I like the whole church very much.  But still...  there are more nice churches in this world than nice gay saunas! 

 

1 hour ago, InBangkok said:

 

I believe @Guest Right is correct. Other countries are becoming more attractive for the gay traveller.

 

 

Which ones?

[Guest Babylon]

On 5/16/2021 at 11:17 AM, Steve5380 said:

 

Thank you again.  This leaves me hope that once the gay scene in BKK resurges again,  Babylon may reopen with the same or a different owner.  I think this makes sense since the name, the prestige and base of customers of this place should add to its value.

Actually it is off topic, but just for info: The owner of Babylon was asked plenty of times to sell the land from property developers. All the years he rejected. The owner did not mind making losses. During the Thai conflict years 2006 - 2010 with plenty of demonstrations, the owner forged out money to pay staff making losses year by year. Dwindling tourists made operations financially difficult. 

This time, Covid, new demonstrations emerging, suffering losses again it was just too much and considering his old age. 

 

 

[Steve5380]

2 minutes ago, Guest Babylon said:

Actually it is off topic, but just for info: The owner of Babylon was asked plenty of times to sell the land from property developers. All the years he rejected. The owner did not mind making losses. During the Thai conflict years 2006 - 2010 with plenty of demonstrations, the owner forged out money to pay staff making losses year by year. Dwindling tourists made operations financially difficult. 

This time, Covid, new demonstrations emerging, suffering losses again it was just too much and considering his old age. 

 

 

It is not completely off topic. 

 

For a gay man after 40 years old, to make losses is not a bad option if there is sufficient wealth, and if it brings some satisfaction.  With the end of life comes SURELY a loss of ALL the money if any is left.  So why wait to lose it all at once?  Most gays don't have children and grandchildren to leave their fortune to,  and even if they have, why cannot they make their own fortune?