AWARE Saga of 2009 (compiled)

[amkies]

What's the difference between the AWARE saga and that of a terrorist attack? The latter happens because a few people share some warped ideologies about how the world should be managed and they try to decipher who's bad and who's not based on their ideologies. But, usually they are quite myopic in their sense of thinking. They only view people who are like them to be worth living. They hijack public platforms to push through their thoughts and demand that attention be given to them.

Fast forward to the AWARE saga. These group of women share a common warped ideology that their Lord doesn't permit homosexuals. They think AWARE has been expressing too much support for the damned group. Now, they hijack a public platform and try to push through their beliefs and ideologies. They want attention to be focused on helping them snub out the damned group.

If terrorists are condemned, why shouldn't the new exco of AWARE be?

[Guest Guest]

aware is about women matters right?

so in order not to discriminate, it doesnt matter if you are lesbian as long as u r woman.

[permanent-guest]

aware is about women matters right?

so in order not to discriminate, it doesnt matter if you are lesbian as long as u r woman.

And they should also deal with the discrimination the female transgenders suffer continuously in the workplace (those ladies who once were men).

But the new ex-co seems to have a negative view of transexuals.

[oralb]

honestly if not the parties involved, the whole AWARE saga sounded like a gripping movie...

first you have the mystery coup, the takeover, the lies, the struggle of the victims

then the mastermind finally appeared, proclaiming her diabloical plan

finally the showdown coming this May where 2 fractions gathered their supporter for a finale...

[oralb]

suggested read of the day

http://mathialee.wordpress.com/2009/04/24/they-came-for-me/

excellent summary of the AWARE incident plus background stories

[Guest -Billy-]

Thank you THIO SU MIEN, i have never liked you since a long time age. Nevertheless, thank you. Because of your wrapped malicious thinking of mastering minding a takeover coup of AWARE, Singapore now has to re-look what is all this gay/ lesbian thing all about.

I read many comments in the on-line citizen, straits times etc. More people are taking a tolerance stand towards gay persons. Singapore is beginning to accept diversity.

However there are also those who (like Thio family and their gang) are very vicious in their outlook. Seems like they would like to see homosexuality disappear from the face of the earth.

People are taking a very hard stand on gay influences in the Polys, colleges, the Unis and National Service. Many parents are particularly concerned as they think that these are dangerous places. As one government minister rightly pointed out, sexuality is a family issue, parents should educate their children about sexual issues as part of the family bonding.

My point is, parents should let their children know everything they need to know about sex, sexuality, pre-marital sex, rape and STD, peer influences etc.. All parents have about 18 years to do this job, afterwhich, all children should have a clear view of these issues and make their own stand and find their own way.

But some parents insist that their children must go certain paths even after they have become adults. If after 18 or more years they can't convince their children about certain issues, you think the child will listen after that? So if I can, I will tell the older persons to learn to relax and learn to let go and learn to accept.

By the way, if you still have doubts about homosexuality, read this report from the American Psychological Association,

there is nothing abnormal about you if you are gay

Link:

http://www.apahelpcenter.org/articles/article.php?id=31

[Guest surelyUGESSian]

honestly if not the parties involved, the whole AWARE saga sounded like a gripping movie...

first you have the mystery coup, the takeover, the lies, the struggle of the victims

then the mastermind finally appeared, proclaiming her diabloical plan

finally the showdown coming this May where 2 fractions gathered their supporter for a finale...

[Nova]

the final twist......

2 of the hushands of these ladies are closet gays!

someone post their photos plz

[eric6363]

The Government has spoken out against it.

The NGOs have spoken out against it.

The highly respectable Old Guard have spoken out against it.

Thousands have spoken out on the internet and newspapers against it.

Christian fundamentalists, do the only decent thing you can do at this stage - resign from AWARE, and form your own hate group! And stop using God's name - you are wearing it down, and you are an embarrassment to all Christians!

[oralb]

the final twist......

2 of the hushands of these ladies are closet gays!

someone post their photos plz

please dont....

we do not have to scoop to their level...

[JOKE mode]

If anyone of you reader are pumping the husbands, do it harder for our sake

[JOKE mode off]

[watergate0254]

So many ill-informed people who clearly cannot differentiate between what is "promoting" or educating", what is "right", "wrong", "neutral" on CNA forum.

Sad. Demise of intelligence. Choosing to make their children ostriches.

http://forum.channelnewsasia.com/viewtopic...3&start=190

http://forum.channelnewsasia.com/viewtopic...75&start=10

http://forum.channelnewsasia.com/viewtopic...68&start=40

[Nova]

So many ill-informed people

Sad. Demise of intelligence. Choosing to make their children ostriches.

[Guest Non DBS customer]

I'm totally surprised the DBS is keeping Jocie on its bankroll. Did they not see what a nervous wreck she has become? And how on earth can she fight for her belief at Aware and still stay focus and still be the vice-president of the credit card department? She needs to resign and do take a long, long rest. Preferably somewhere far, far away from Singapore. Poor woman.

[Guest GUEST]

Brothers and sisters, this is important, please take a minute to read this:

If we want to win this, we have to highlight that this is not a issue about Gays vs Straights but rather Christians taking over control of Singapore's NGOs - otherwise we are falling into the trap of the New AWARE exco.

People become so auto-alarmed when they hear that the old AWARE is against prejudice against gay people and lesbians but this will not help the old Guards. What we need to do is to go to the nearest Internet cafe or sauna internet and inform the various mainstream forums e.g. Hardware Zone, CNA, Stomp etc about the alarming fact that six of the nine New EXCO committee members are from the same Christian church group. Is this really healthy and truly representative of the diverse religious and racial make-up of such an important national women's group?

Do we really want a Christian-conservative group to take charge of a national women's group? Who will against the new EXCo using its funds under AWARE to promote pro-Christian activities and associations like what Josie Lau (the new President) did with DBS for the christian organisation FOCUS on The Family as the Vice President of DBS Credit Cards Group?

What is next? That more and more national associations fall under a group of Christian-conservatives hailing from the same Church group? And they call this a coincidence?

Highlight the above but to give your arguments credibility - make sure you do not insult Christianity, do not insult the New EXCO members personally, and do not talk about the gay vs straights arguments. The New EXCO want to cloud the issue that six 0f the nine EXCO members are all Chrisitans from the same church. What about representation from Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu, Taoist and aethist women?

[Nova]

If we want to win this, we have to highlight that this is not a issue about Gays vs Straights but rather Christians taking over control of Singapore's NGOs - otherwise we are falling into the trap of the New AWARE exco.

I agree totally. That's the only issue supporters of the new exco are capable of attacking.

I'm monitoring the forums and giving them a piece of my mind.

Please join in, but do not make it into a personal attack.

Keep reminding them that the old guards are doing a lot more good work other than the issue about homosexuality.

Those who have better things to do, please don't make comments about us wasting our time blah blah blah.

If you're not willing to do anything constructive, just keep quiet and watch.

[Guest Guest]

It will be good if we can help to correct the discussions in the CNA and other forums about the fact that this is NOT a issue about gays or lesbianism. This is about the need to keep AWARE as a neutral multi-religious organisation which will protect the interest of all women in Singapore.

Please contribute your points of discussion here:

http://forum.channelnewsasia.com/viewtopic.php?t=238815

[ixmog]

I think Josie is a disgrace to the Christians in the name of God.

Many Christians in Singapore tends to be over zealous about doing good of speading the word of God.

But with their self judgement on others and implementing their own method and ideas. They wanted others to be like them or do things according to what think they themselves are ideal example. Josie should have form her own organisation for support of straight woman as what she wants instead of taking over Aware in a coordinated way. Can tell from the interviews that Josie is the power craze kind of woman. You are such a shame.

I'm still with God but I stop going to churches in Singapore due to many hypocritic people there.

I went to one of the big churches in the past. After the Sunday services, fellow Christians met for a break and normally everyone were bragging about their status and wealth they attained in the society. You get to hear them saying about their cars, condos, investment and wealth. Sunday services is gathering to show off. It's like a fashion show. Especially the ladies were showing off their branded stuff to everyone.

It's real sad that the house of God had turned out that way.

That's why I stop going to church. Not becos of my homosexuality.

But the people's behavior in church.

I see that the new Aware exco members are such kind.

End of the day who are on the losing end ?

The woman. The Christians. The people that in need of help.

[ixmog]

Lastly, I don't understand why homosexuality had been brought into the subject for Aware's own internal conflict. Josie seems to love to criminalize homosexuality regardless whether gays or lesbian. Are gays and lesbian be discriminate due to the new leaders pro-family mind set ?

It gives us a bad name.

Who are we to judge others regardless of what they are.

Only God can judge us.

[oralb]

I have edited away the phone number of the members of the new exco

1. In line with our policy that no mobile or contact number be posted, unless the establishment wish to promote ownself or he is a home based massuer

2. Please keep your cool and not doing things that will incurr public warth, by posting the contact numbers, there be a tendency for someone to pick up a call and hurl abuse or insults or simply plain disturbance call. DO NOT FALL FOR THIS TRAP. They are waiting for that to happen so that they can announce to the public and press that we are a pest to society

3. Disturbance is an offence in law, BUT avoiding their business isnt. Hence i kept the names and the organization they worked for. Moreover these info has been splashed in ST and CNA. Now you know who and where they worked, do your utmost to avoid giving them business.

4. Make it a point to inform others to avoid the businesses (eg DBS credit cards, lifeline medical clinics)

5. Some of the readers have done the right thing by monitoring and posting on other forums to state that this is not PLU against Xtian. When you are discussing with peers or posting online, highlight that the new group of exco has been shady in their action and motives, there was accusation of them telling lies (questions like did they really NOT known each other even though they belonged to the same church? Was there a cohensive action to take over AWARE?) That they are hijacking AWARE to prove their point.

[Nova]

I agree totally. That's the only issue supporters of the new exco are capable of attacking.

I'm monitoring the forums and giving them a piece of my mind.

Please join in, but do not make it into a personal attack.

Keep reminding them that the old guards are doing a lot more good work other than the issue about homosexuality.

Those who have better things to do, please don't make comments about us wasting our time blah blah blah.

If you're not willing to do anything constructive, just keep quiet and watch.

[Guest Guest]

Lastly, I don't understand why homosexuality had been brought into the subject for Aware's own internal conflict. Josie seems to love to criminalize homosexuality regardless whether gays or lesbian. Are gays and lesbian be discriminate due to the new leaders pro-family mind set ?

It gives us a bad name.

Who are we to judge others regardless of what they are.

Only God can judge us.

I speak from experience coming from ten years of work and contact with the singaporean churches.

Many of them view numerals as a key disadvantage. Therefore, the emphasis for almost all ministries, is to gain new members. You have heard rumours of how new converts are given missions to find at least two other converts etc. I wouldn't comment on that. What I would say is that a lot of the activities, especially for children, focus on just one message. You are special. You are different. You are chosen. YOU ARE SUPERIOR.

And nothing else. I believe I am right to infer that they don't venture into other areas like how exactly to be a good person, so as to make being a christian easier for these kids. It retains them. At the same time, the constant massaging of pride is very attractive and seductive.

But these sort of tactics only lasts a while. Soon, the fire wears off. So what do you do? You use the time-proven technique to rally people. FIND A COMMON ENEMY. But we live in a pluralistic age. You most certainly can't attack the other races, or faiths. So they center on a group without an official voice. And they make it livid with all sorts of frightening scenarios and "what would happen."

Thio Su Mien has written countless articles on the dangers of making anti-gay speeches a form of hate speeches. Consider this. Would she be able to pull this stunt had anti-gay speeches be considered as hate speech?

She would have lost her last psychological instrument.

And once you start on this path, you can't stop. You have to constantly substantiate yourself. Especially when none of your doomsday prophecies come true. So she pulled this stunt.

[Guest Guest]

Lifeline Medical Group Pte Ltd

Blk 118 Rivervale Drive

#02-18, Rivervale Plaza

Singapore 540118

Lifeline Bishan Medical Clinic

Blk 501, Bishan St 11

#01-376

Singapore 570501

Lifeline Yishun Ring Medical

Blk 846 Yishun Ring Rd #01-3615

Singapore

Lifeline Medical Centre

Blk 710 Clementi West St 2,

#01-261,

Singapore 120710

760846

[Guest Guest]

Needless to say, you guys know THEY are also scanning all these forums.

I think you shouldn't post all these addresses etc openly. THEY are going to record this and show it as evidence, how militant gays are.

Remember, your actual battle is not directly with them. It is to win the support from the middle public.

There's a PM function? Use that instead?

[Nova]

http://wayangparty.com/?p=8302

Check this out, interesting.

[subbtmchn73]

Firstly, just to state that i support the old guards of AWARE and have signed the online petition in their support. Have also put it up my facebook as well as asked my female friends to support them although all of them said they were too busy to bother. I guess that partly explains why the membership of AWARE is so low.

But what i want to say here is giving the new EXCO benefit of the doubt that they really did not conspire and plan the take over, however, i feel they have been manipulated either intentionally or unintentionally by they Mentor into the take over.

I conclude the above based purely from the interviews reported in ST.

1. Dr T was the Mentor for a number of the new members. When asked why Dr T did not run for the president, one of the members replied for her that AWARE is too small an outfit for her. This clearly shows how much they respect and look up to her. Thus also shows how much her views may impact their actions.

2. Dr T commented on the power of networking and emailing. So basically all she needs to do is to send emails to her friends and mentorees and talk about her views and what she feel a "responsible" woman should do. Naturally those looking up to her will be moved to take action. There might not have been an intentional and well planned out take over.

3. The reason why so many of the new members all seem to have a connection and claim that they did not know each other could be because it was just a email viral effect starting off from Dr T. So Dr T would obviously send it out to her mailing list. Then it will spread like, getting forwarded. So again giving them the benefit of the doubt, they might be telling the truth about not knowing each other or having planned the take over.

I find this a very interesting case study of the new viral communication and a soft approach to "gathering an army" for your cause. She might have been a bit traditional by using email only. For the younger crowd, facebook and twitter will be the force to reckon with.

It also raises the other issues of mentorship. If i am looking for a mentor, i make sure i have more than one. Unless you totally look up to that one mentor and want to walk in his/her shadow or grow in his/her image. And not sure how many reading this have had the chance of knowing a mentor and mentoree relationship. I feel it is actually a very exclusive club. Cause usually only successful people will mentor someone and it usually has some power and concept of gathering a loyal following. Although they will tell you they just want to help you.

[subbtmchn73]

http://wayangparty.com/?p=8302

Check this out, interesting.

[Guest laggard]

Not meant to stimulate a discussion about Christian practices.

since there is some discussion as to whether the women of new guard are measuring up to expectations of women in the Bible, i have attached a link here about the ideal womanhood in the Christian context.

http://www.wcg.org/lit/bible/poet/prov31.htm

[Guest tolerance]

The Anglican Church of South Africa has a NOBEL peace prize winner 1984 for preaching tolerance.

He said i quote.

In an interview with BBC Radio 4 on 18 November 2007, Tutu accused the church of _being obsessed with homosexuality and declared: "If God, as they say, is homophobic, I wouldn't worship that God."[74]

in the debate about Anglican views of homosexuality he has opposed Christian discrimination against homosexuals while suggesting homosexual church leaders should currently remain celibate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desmond_Tutu

The new Aware ex cos apparently comes under the Anglican Diocese because they are members of the Anglican Church of Our Saviour.

[permanent-guest]

http://theonlinecitizen.com/2009/04/breaki...-at-aware-eogm/

BREAKING NEWS: Staff sent out email asking members to vote at Aware EOGM

coos-service-260409-02226 APRIL, 2009 –A CHURCH of our Saviour (COOS) staff sent out an email calling church members to vote at AWARE’s upcoming EOGM, the church spokesman confirmed yesterday.

For a while, it had been unclear whether the leaked email messages, readable in various forums, were authentic.

Speaking on the sidelines after Sunday’s 10.30am service, the church spokesman verified that only Shawn Tay and Linda Seah’s email messages are genuine. Both are staff of the church.

Mr Tay sent out an email on 17th April calling for church members to join AWARE and support the new Executive Committee members. He is from Choices Ministry, a department specialising in homosexual counseling.

In the email, Mr Tay called for “all responsible females to sign up for membership with AWARE immediately, and also to attend this all-important EGM so as to vote against changing the Constitution.”

As for Ms Seah, who is a zone pastor, she sent Senior Pastor Derek Hong an email on 16th April stating that “the number of members registered on Tuesday night is 13 out of 40 who turned up.” As of the time of this piece’s publication, the church has not been able to clarify what this means.

Both email messages were sent only after news of Aware’s takeover broke on The Straits Times.

It is also unclear if the rest of the leaked email are authentic.While admitting that their pastors were involved in garnering support for the new Executive Committee, the church spokesman denied allegations that they instigated the takeover of AWARE.

This is in line with an earlier claim made by the new Executive Committee at a press conference held at Raffles Town Club. They asserted that the church was not involved in the takeover.

“There is no church connection. The church is not at all involved in secular affairs,” they said.

The spokesman maintained that it was the church members’ prerogative to join AWARE, rather than a decision by the church staff’s.

Pastor Hong, who preached during the service, could not be approached directly by TOC for comment.

Pastor voices support for new Aware Exco

While COOS has denied involvement in the AWARE takeover, they are actively supportive of their church members getting involved in the EOGM to support the new Executive Committee.

Pastor Hong devoted most of his sermon on the issue of homosexuality, voicing support for the endeavours of the new Aware team. The service was attended by about 800 people.

Calling for solidarity, he implored the women in the church to “unite with the sisters and support them.” He also said that the new team’s actions are not “a crusade against the people,” but instead a move to ensure that the nation does not cross the line drawn by God.

He also spoke against the “neutral” portrayal of homosexuality taught by AWARE to schoolgirls. The Christian’s belief system, he argued, prevents them from accepting homosexuality as “neutral.” The Bible clearly teaches that it is wrong, and that is the position the church have to take.

“Christians have the responsibility to protect the young, the vulnerable, and the innocent, even though its not popular or politically correct, even though people may not understand or they may get angry with us,” he said.

The pastor, however, sees a silver lining in the controversies. Contrasting Singapore against countries that are heading towards liberalisation, he is glad the Aware team stood up for what the Bible deemed was right. He said: “We need to thank God that because section 377A still stands, we will not move in that direction.”

During the service, new Aware president Josie Lau and her husband Alan Chin were called on stage. While Mr Chin did speak to the congregation, it was not on the Aware controversy, but rather his claim that God has healed his sister of brain stem damage.

After his sharing, Pastor Hong then prayed for the couple, and beckoned the church to join him.

COOS against gay-bashing

Within his sermon, the pastor reiterated the church’s position on homosexuality, which can be found on the COOS website. Basing his position purely based on the Holy Bible, he said that it is not a matter of personal opinion as homosexuality is clearly a sin against God.

“It’s black-and-white,” he said, “It’s not because I don’t like somebody, but because the Bible says so.”

He then stated that there are other religions that are against homosexuality as well, including Islam and even Judaism. However, he finds it strange that “the homosexual community never attacks the Islamic people for having that stand.”

Wearing a bright green shirt with a patterned tie, the pastor gave no indication of being worn down by the controversy. In fact, he spoke passionately at certain points in the sermon, his voice booming through the speakers.

“God does not grade sins,” he said with conviction.

While homosexuality is clearly wrong, it is not the worst sin either, he said. People who are involved in homosexuality are no worse than people who lie. However, there is a tendency for the church to condemn homosexuality more than other wrongdoings.

Pastor Hong also vehemently denounced gay-bashing, noting that homosexuals are as deserving of equal rights to jobs, housing, education, health, and welfare as straight people are. Objecting to the use of homophobic expressions, he noted that many languages and dialects have derogatory terms for more effeminate men. He called such verbal abuse “evil.”

The preacher emphasised that Christians should not feel too smug about themselves either, because God loves homosexuals as well. Christians are not better than homosexuals in any way, he said, but are saved only by the grace of God.

COOS, he added, frequently gives financial aid to HIV patients, some of whom are homosexuals. So far, the church has given food supplements to 100 patients.

Gays can become straight

“Change is possible,” said the pastor, once again underlining a Biblical perspective. However, he also cited real-life examples and scientific research as further proof that homosexuals can turn straight. Some are found in his church, he claimed.

Nevertheless, he stopped short of proclaiming total transformation in these individuals. In fact, these people still struggle with homosexual thoughts, just that they no longer have sex with other men.

“…they have become more straight, if you like, just like all of us, we’re still a work in progress, we may not commit adultery but it doesn’t mean we don’t struggle with those thoughts,” he said.

Pastor Hong also refuted the idea that homosexuals are born the way they are, and he denied the existence of a “homosexual gene.” He draws on studies from NARTH, which he says is a secular, non-religious organisation that does scientific research on homosexuality.

Calling the nature argument “propaganda”, he maintained that developmental factors feature more in the development of homosexuality.

Caution towards militant gay activist groups

The pastor spent significant time speaking against what he calls “discrimination against people with pro-family values.”

Christians have often also been misunderstood in the media. They are labeled as anti-homosexuals when in fact they are simply against the practice. He called this labeling a “trap” by the “propaganda of the gay activist people.”

An example he cited of such discrimination was the recent Miss USA pageant. Pastor Hong showed a news clip on Fox News where front-runner Miss California spoke out against gay marriage when asked a question by judge Perez Hilton, a celebrity blogger who is openly gay.

Many believed her answer cost her the crown.

The clip concluded with Mr Hilton in another footage making insulting remarks about Miss California and shouting vulgarities. Pastor Hong called this “just the tip of the iceberg.”

Calling for a resistance against the agenda of certain gay activists, he cautioned that traditional values and lifestyles can be undermined.

He said: “They want to change the values and principles to what we deem to be normal to their own pattern of life. If you even dare to speak against it, you get disqualified, you get penalised, you get discriminated against.”

Church members voice support

COOS members which TOC spoke to after the service are supportive of the new AWARE team.

Mr Wong, a church member in his forties who does not attends cell group, said that the new Executive Committee should be given a chance to prove themselves. After all, they took over Aware legally.

Some church members have even joined Aware this year. Speaking anonymously, they insisted it was their own personal decision, and that no coercion was involved.

While their decision to join Aware was based on their convictions as a Christian, they pointed out that Christians are not the only ones resisting homosexuality.

“I mean if you’re a parent, and you learn about what they teach in school, won’t you be concerned?” said a lady.

Latest figures for Aware membership stands at more than 880. It is unclear how many church members have joined the organisation.

Edited April 27, 2009 by permanent-guest

[Nova]

Some good news at last.

http://www.moe.gov.sg/media/forum/2009/04/...ments-and-c.php

Though it's not concluded as the EOGM is this sat, i hope there'll be further good news.

Kudos to anyone who helps out in the forums.

[amkies]

Read the last paragraph "values taught should not deviate from the social norms accepted by mainstream society in Singapore". So, in a way, it is to say no homosexual stuff to be taught in school. Handling homosexuality is part and parcel of the life that a kid would have to grow up to accept. Precisely because schools used to frown upon homosexuality, we have people like the Thios who come up with absurd comments to put down homosexuals and incite unwarranted fears. I can't imagine our kids growing up, unable to handle homosexual issues in the big wide world out there where people are gradually removing that social stigma. Talk about world-class education.

But, i think it is nonetheless good to see MOE's rebuttal to "show" Thio's ailing memory or should i say "correct" the nicely orchestrated inaccuracies.

Edited April 28, 2009 by amkies

[Nova]

The following is a very funny comment in ST forum:

Although Dr Thio appears in picture with a full head of dark hair, let's not forget the woman is already 70+. I hope MOE will drop any intention of taking any legal actions against the old lady if she failed to produce a reasonable explanation for her dubious claim. Her action was driven mainly by fear. When there is a lack of knowledge and understanding, then comes the fear. Unknown gives life to fear. What Dr. Thio should have done is really to attend a full session of the sex education organized by the old Aware along with the young girls and boys. In that case, she can better judge for herself if Aware possessed the magic formula to convert young souls into gays/lesbians.

My sincere advice to Dr Thio is let's not be naughty anymore, you're too old for that. It's not nice for you to create such havoc and division in our society. When you wake up the next morning, the sun is still shinning although I am not sure if Josie will get to keep her DBS's job. For your own good, sleep early, do your tai chi in the morning, take light meals, preach love and unity, mellow down your NMP's daughter and straighten up her slang, clean your false teeth diligently, drink your milk and go to bed early again. See, life needs not be so antagonistic.

[evianguy]

Lifeline Medical Group Pte Ltd

Blk 118 Rivervale Drive

#02-18, Rivervale Plaza

Singapore 540118

Lifeline Bishan Medical Clinic

Blk 501, Bishan St 11

#01-376

Singapore 570501

Lifeline Yishun Ring Medical

Blk 846 Yishun Ring Rd #01-3615

Singapore

Lifeline Medical Centre

Blk 710 Clementi West St 2,

#01-261,

Singapore 120710

760846

We have removed Thio Su Mien's firm TSMP Law Corporation from our company's panel of law firms and replaced it with another firm, and our HR has removed Lifeline from its panel of clinics and added similar number of clinics in those vacinity.

[Guest -billy-]

We have removed Thio Su Mien's firm TSMP Law Corporation from our company's panel of law firms and replaced it with another firm, and our HR has removed Lifeline from its panel of clinics and added similar number of clinics in those vacinity.

Glad you did that brother, this is an excellent example of action speaks louder than words. Don't let those damn people bully us.

[Guest Guest]

She cannot do Tai Chi. Tai Chi was born and is inseparable from Taoist concepts.

The christian community has recently set the message that Yoga cannot be separated from Hinduism. And christians doing that is a bad reflection on their faith. You can find this article in sg.christianpost.com

Anyway, I think the Yin Yang in her is so disrupted Mr Zhang himself can't restore it.

The following is a very funny comment in ST forum:

Although Dr Thio appears in picture with a full head of dark hair, let's not forget the woman is already 70+. I hope MOE will drop any intention of taking any legal actions against the old lady if she failed to produce a reasonable explanation for her dubious claim. Her action was driven mainly by fear. When there is a lack of knowledge and understanding, then comes the fear. Unknown gives life to fear. What Dr. Thio should have done is really to attend a full session of the sex education organized by the old Aware along with the young girls and boys. In that case, she can better judge for herself if Aware possessed the magic formula to convert young souls into gays/lesbians.

My sincere advice to Dr Thio is let's not be naughty anymore, you're too old for that. It's not nice for you to create such havoc and division in our society. When you wake up the next morning, the sun is still shinning although I am not sure if Josie will get to keep her DBS's job. For your own good, sleep early, do your tai chi in the morning, take light meals, preach love and unity, mellow down your NMP's daughter and straighten up her slang, clean your false teeth diligently, drink your milk and go to bed early again. See, life needs not be so antagonistic.

[Guest guest]

Let's not gloat prematurely. I spoke with a few ladies who just joined AWARE. They are not impressed with the Taleban style of takeover and the bad press of the new guard, but at the same time, are not completely assured yet that the old guard are not without fault. They are attending the EGM with a wait and see attitude. Let's hope the old guard is able to convince them at the EGM for their support.

[oralb]

Latest News:

The new guard had changed the venue of the EGM to expo.

AWARE EGM venue moved to EXPO, next to “Transformation Conference 2009″ co-organized by COOS and 40 other Churches!

http://wayangparty.com/?p=8542

Damn scheming

A call to wage a ’spiritual’ battle for AWARE (now we know why the EGM venue was changed)

http://wayangparty.com/?p=8516

[amkies]

My, oh my. I am so amused. From HDB hub to Expo and now to Suntec. How come these bitches can change venues so easily and so frequently? Don't they even have to even think of penalties? Strange.

What's next? Cancellation of the meeting due to Swine Flu?

[Guest Guest]

The government must have forced them to change to suntec. Having this next to an emotional christian event is just inviting physical clashes and violence.

[luciferbear]

Anyway. We will be going to register.

LB

[oralb]

by now, it is not about logic, reasoning or even justice. It has come down to numbers game - whoever side has the most number will win.

honestly i am not optimistic for the old guards, I read that the new exco has gathered more than 1000 members, plus the proximity to the church event next door, the numbers will outweight the former exco.

Another tactic that I believed the new exco will use is to open membership at the door, tapping into the church event next door, the number will even increase tremendously!

[permanent-guest]

by now, it is not about logic, reasoning or even justice. It has come down to numbers game - whoever side has the most number will win.

honestly i am not optimistic for the old guards, I read that the new exco has gathered more than 1000 members, plus the proximity to the church event next door, the numbers will outweight the former exco.

Another tactic that I believed the new exco will use is to open membership at the door, tapping into the church event next door, the number will even increase tremendously!

Too bad for the new ex-co, the police has intervened to ask EXPO not to rent the venue to AWARE. Now the venue of EGM has been changed to Suntec City. No longer next to the Christian event in EXPO. But still many who are hardcore supporters of the new exco will attend the EGM at Suntec.

[permanent-guest]

A Christian woman's call to other Christians not to support the new exco of AWARE - help spread the message to all your Christian friends.

from:

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=159...hp?id=573881201

Christians in Singapore, listen! You should not be this conflicted about the AWARE debacle. It appears that a few churches have already taken the opportunity to preach on the issue of homosexuality from the pulpit. Some Christians have also been rattling on about it being time to make a stand and be counted for what one truly believes.

So this is me making a stand right here. I have been a Bible-believing Christian for 25 years now. I want first to acknowledge fellow believers who, like me, are shocked, angered, and saddened by the takeover and feel that their faith has been hijacked and their views ignored. I know that a lot of such affected Christians are out there. There is also another group which may not agree with the new team's tactics but admires its fervour or sympathises with it for the heat it has been getting.

But, most of all, I want to address a crucial third party: Christian women who have been encouraged to stand up and be counted for their beliefs. I wish to appeal to their good sense in these last hours. You may be one of these and have even joined, or are planning to join, AWARE to help swing the votes in favour of the new ex-co on Saturday. Especially if I am describing you, please read on!

Yes, there are times when a Christian needs to make a courageous stand – but, in every event, always ask yourself: For what cause is this? What context does it serve? The current scenario is not one where we are being asked what our beliefs on certain issues are or whether Christianity and homosexuality are compatible or we are being mocked or discriminated against. It is a simple context where a group of well-meaning Christians infiltrated a secular organisation in order to be in a position to dictate their own values in its daily running. In this light, what a Christian may feel about issues like homosexuality is besides the point!

As a secular body, AWARE rightly cannot have a vision that treats women from different backgrounds through the outlook of just one religious system. Indeed, I dare say that an appropriate Christian response is to resist the actions of these Christians. Just as God gave every person free choice and the opportunity to believe, we ought to support the sanctity of this right for others to make up their own minds and live their own lives. Just as we do not force the Christian faith down someone's throat against his or her will, we should not take over a non-religious organisation for the single purpose of making others unlike us behave as we believe. To do this would be a gross misapplication of the message of Jesus.

If you support the new ex-co's actions, be aware that you are sending a string of possibly irreversible wrong signals to every Singaporean. Consider carefully whether you are willing to shoulder the responsibility of damages that would affect the longstanding good work of Christians in Singapore. Since the government has chosen not to be involved in the matter so far, whatever happens will be seen clearly by all as the response of particular sectors of society.

Here is my short list of obvious implications:

[1] Support the new ex-co, and you are effectively saying that you condone its quasi-corporate act of infiltration, with related strategies of secrecy, disinformation, moral coercion, and fear-mongering. You are saying that you support its less-than-Christian covert moves more than traditionally Christian ones like dialogue, open engagement, honesty, and clarity.

[2] Support the new ex-co, and we will go down a slippery road with wide-ranging repercussions for all. Don’t believe for a moment that the manoeuvring will stop here. What this invites others to see is that infiltration is the most effective way for small groups of like-minded individuals to seize power quickly -- and where will this end? What is to stop any religious or ideological group from doing the same to any social institution at every level? In the long run, who do you think loses?

[3] Support the new ex-co, and you potentially make light of the freedom that is God’s gift to every human being. Against your best intentions, you may send out instead the message that we Christians think that we know better than everyone else and that we are willing to outflank, overpower, and overwhelm if we do not get our way.

[4] Support the new ex-co, and, if they stay and behave as predicted, you will be directly responsible for undoing the trust that many Christians have taken years to build with their non-Christian friends. This is a trust built on mutual respect. You will have made the Gospel of Christ more difficult to hear for years to come because people will think that they know what it is about. You will have created a new generation of Christ-haters.

This matter, in short, is not to be treated lightly. Jesus tells us all to be "wise as serpents, and harmless as doves". There are times to be passionate and helpful in a gungho way, but this is not the time. Christians can be wrong about many things too. So please, by all means, pray for the AWARE debacle to be resolved amicably and for Christians in AWARE, but do not, in the name of our common faith, go in blind support of other Christians because you are Christian!

Yours Truly,

Gwee Li Sui

[nvms]

本文已徵求Fridae.com 的同意，預先於此發表。原稿應先在專欄《梅蜚澀吳》發表，感謝fridae.com 的諒解。

峨嵋再現、滅絕再世…

金庸名著《倚天屠龍記》裡有位顯眼的女配角名為滅絕師太 ，此人具有偏激、固執、冷酷而又自命正義的性格，雖是尼姑本應是慈悲為懷，但其人心中充滿怨恨，卻不知她出手時極為狠毒 ，出招即奪命不可，加上抱持著「真理與我同行，逆我者皆邪惡」的信念，讓人印象深刻。

此角色乍看之下還與近期某位宗教激進份子極為相似，其個性簡直和滅絕師太猶如同一個模子印出來般，鮮明的讓人驚嘆！

打從一開始，同志群眾在許多宗教激進份子眼中就宛如明教，明教即是魔教，對於他們而言，明教違背了他們宗教的教義，乃天地不容，凡舉和明教有關的活動都不應該於這彈丸小島上得以進行，能破壞就近其所能的破壞或抹黑，完全沒有商量的餘地。

兩年前的野餐事件，周芷若已對同志群眾出手，使出一招聲東擊西，而接連下手時的狠勁兒大伙也領教及見識。上次搞破壞無法得逞，雖然保住了她個人之顏面，無形中卻讓眾人更加提防未來此人會再次興風作浪，使出更惡毒的招數襲擊同志群眾⋯。

彈丸小島一直都風平浪靜，於去年年末一起刷卡捐款事件又掀起風波，大師姐丁敏君牛刀小試小露一下身手，當時雖無浮現表面，卻為“奪權”事件埋下了伏筆⋯。

今年峨嵋派領導層改選，在毫無防備之下發生了奪權事件，大師姐丁敏君一躍當選新盟主，連同其他子弟兵將原有領導層成員硬生生的從位子給拖下，奪權之說即刻傳遍民間， 新盟主還一再否認是有計謀，但一些信函外洩而被網友揭穿，不僅如此就連背後的藏鏡人也被揪出。

策劃整起奪權事件的滅絕師太不僅毫無歉意，還大言不愧的搬出一堆歪論，試圖模糊焦點； 滅絕師太大可不參預而輕鬆安享晚年， 卻基於心中對同志的仇恨，勢必要將同志群眾剷除到底。

而丁敏君則表面盡其量在呈現和藹可親的一面，間中卻隱藏不住尖酸伶俐、愛耍陰謀詭計的嘴臉， 骨子裡更是猙獰可惡到了極點。

於一篇《金學家》評論金庸小說的文章所提：「滅絕師太所代表的是一種嫉惡如仇的力量，認定是惡就非滅絕不可，使用手段再下流，也可以原諒自己。」

按照觀點，滅絕師太還是要“滅絕”惡的，只是所用之手段太惡劣而已；滅絕師太的可惡不僅是手段問題，她所謂的“嫉惡”其實只是一種假象，是一種作偽。滅絕師太並不是一個嫉惡如仇的人，實際上是在公報私仇⋯。

這原本應該是“她們”的事，卻因為幕後策劃藏鏡人是滅絕師太，才在同志群眾當中掀起漣漪，許多人也因此更為關切事情的後續發展。事件會發展至甚麼樣的局面，目前仍無法猜測及預估，但僅憑她以及背後的子弟兵想滅絕一整個族群，頂多只是多加阻撓罷了，未來世界會變成怎麼樣，她則是無法干涉其進展。

我們都不知曉滅絕師太何以會如此憎恨同志群眾，不僅如此，連帶還將這股怨恨心一併灌輸給予周芷若，讓她的一生也背負著怨恨。

一個女人怎會如此殘忍，難不成背後有某些不為人知、不可告人的祕密？

這原本就是多元的世界，不由得任何人阻礙地球旋轉，這憎恨猶如世代家仇般，滅之絕之更是她的終極心願⋯。

這又何苦叻⋯⋯。

撰文 ：吳瑣慰

歌曲聯想：

古巨基 － 亂 （Strings Fever 專輯，金牌大風）

http://www.51t.com/ting/cd5afa0a/7cf18504/

Edited April 30, 2009 by nvms

[Guest Guest]

To have selected the venue of Singapore Expo in the first place shows poor judgement by the new exco

[Guest Guest]

#

Archbishop Desmond Tutu of Anglican Church in South Africa who won the Nobel Peace Price in 1994 , has this to say.

In an interview with BBC Radio 4 on 18 November 2007, Tutu accused the church of being obsessed with homosexuality and declared: “If God, as they say, is homophobic, I wouldn’t worship that God.”[77]

Dear readers, if you have the time please read the chapter on church reform in this ,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desmond_Tutu

The COOS is under the Anglican archdiose in Singapore.

Isn’t what Archbishop Desmond Tutu said in 2007 exactly what is happening in COOS which Josie LAu belongs to . The COOS church is obsessed with homosexuality.

We should ask the X tians , is GOD homophobic ??

And to add salt to the wound of COOS, the Anglican Church itself is not in agreement in its ranks about the homosexual issue. Progressive churches in the west like the Anglican Church of England, The North American Anglican church and the South African Anglican Church have a more tolerant view on homosexulality . Read more at

http://schools-wikipedia.org/wp/r/Rowan_Williams.htm

refer to chapter on homosexuality

Just look at how people of responsibility in the Anglican Church in the west frame their arguments with sensible reason, fair logic and thinking. and humility unlike The new aware Exco curt and closed argument type of mentality.

Why the difference you may ask , because in the west like UK and USA , the media will ask very pertinent questions to as to how you defend your views about homosexuality.

If they sense a persoanl view involve they will rip your defence to shreds and force you to say it is purely a persoanl view and should not be applied to society in general.

Society is secular and should so.

Why is it so hard for the New Excos of AWARE with members of COOS to admit to themselves that the old EXCO of Aware did carry out their duties with an awareness that Singapore is a secular place with people from a multi religious background and and even bigger majority of people who are secular in their outlook, they may have a religious view but they keep it to themselves knowing that society in general have a market place of pluralitic views.

[Guest protestagainstthio]

As a director, Thio is not in charge of the operation and sales, so whether M1 sink or float, it is hard to pinpoint her.

However in the case of DBS, Lau is held responsible for the credit card results. Any significant drop in results will drastically impact on her, esp after her public rebutted DBS. Not to mention their recent support of FoTF, whereas M1 till now has been orientation-neutral in their operation.

while it is true that catching the king is important, sometimes snapping off the feathers of the bird will keep it grounded...

my friend and i have just switched from m1 to another as a protest. hope all bw will join in and do same iso complaining.

[Guest Godly]

Josie and Co idolised their own pastor than the true God. I feel sad for them.

[Guest We Are Not Amused]

What is the difference between a religion and a cult?

Mainstream religions are respectful and tolerant of other religions and points of view even as they encourage their faithful to adhere to their own particular doctrines. Mainstream religions do not seek to impose their particular religious doctrines on society at large but rather to engage society in dialogue from a platform of a clearly defined, transparently set-up religious organisation.

Cults, on the other hand, are pseudo religious groupings obsessed with an extremist fundamentalist ideology hell bent on pushing their warped agenda under the guise of some innocuous initiative out of purported "concern" for society at large using any and all means necessary to achieve their objectives. Whatever methods they employ, the ends justify the means and they are not averse to shrouding their actions and motivations under the cloak of "religious" / "faith-based" reasons as they interpret it. Their single-minded obsession with the cause is driven by a handful of sociopath leaders and diehard loyalists who are egocentric megalomaniacs.

How different are cults from a terrorist organisation?

Cults and terrorist organisations share the same characteristics. While cults may not seem to cause collateral damage by bombs and / or weapons of mass destruction, their damage to societal cohesion and harmony, particularly in multi-ethnic and multi-religious societies is considerable if left unchecked.

Singapore is not a theocracy but a secular society. When a cult seizes control by hijacking a secular organisation to steer it away from an inclusive position to one that favours their cult perspectives, this is no less an act of terrorism and deserves a robust response to protect the peace and harmony of Singapore society. Just as the Internal Security Act was invoked to suppress, eradicate and rehabilitate communists and communalists, it should now be used on self-serving socially divisive cults. However rather than incarcerate them, it would be more prudent to banish them from Singapore especially in these trying economic times so as to conserve our resources. After all we could do with 4,000 less troublemakers. :whistle: Banishment will also give these cult members an opportunity to demonstrate the depth of their "faith" as they seek out any asylum country, which will nurture their homophobic sensibilities. :smokin:

However if the powers that be do not see an organisation that runs re-education programmes to convert homosexuals as a cult, then perhaps it is time for PLUs to form an organisation that runs programmes to eradicate the scourge of heterosexuality through re-education since what is good for the goose must also be good for the gander! :twisted:

[Guest gayboy]

Hi dear friends,

Let's pray for the good and health of AWARE old guard. These group of woman are battling against homophobic church for our rights to exist and live. They are doing a good cause for the society and all of us here. They are so wonderful people out there who truly understand us, our needs and fear. Today is the there without govt interferences to voice out discrimination, today will be marked gay rights day on 2 May 2009.