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City Harvest Church Discussion - Kong Hee & Sun Ho (Compiled)


amkies

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whole world already know that all the titles that sun had are from where, not that she had many fans, buy the money from her own church, what a joke, those staffs include her husband are guilty told us all, shame.

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9 Reasons Why City Harvest Church Was the Devil To Me

http://gerashen.com/2015/10/22/8-reasons-why-city-harvest-church-was-the-devil-to-me/

Harvest people – but through my years I’ve learnt that all they know is to spout out loud their blinded ‘opinions’.

People: They’re not opinions if you were brainwashed into it; that just makes it an influence over a weak mind.

I dare say this.

Why? Because I was one of them.

It was quite a number of years back, when I was still in secondary school. To be honest, I didn’t grow up in a happy home and endless hopes of getting out of my abyss was just part of my daily routine. While there were others who asked me to join their ‘gangs’, I didn’t want my daddy to look down from Heaven and be disappointed that he didn’t live long enough to love & protect me.

Soon enough I was invited to City Harvest Church and was quite intrigued by their style of worship. At that time, Charismatic churches weren’t very well-known in Singapore. So when songs had strong beats, fast rhythms and people grooving to them – it all seemed really new.

And deep down I wanted to believe that maybe, just maybe… They were the family that I lost. Oh, how stupid I was.

It wasn’t too long before the whole hype of their music tuned down a little and other ugly things started to sprout.

Disclaimer: Whatever I share here is entirely my own experiences and from my perspective, which can be limited. So if you experienced anything otherwise or feel that I’m spouting nonsense – you’re welcome to leave. Thank you.

First, I’ll start with offerings.

Quite a norm of the church, yes? So unlike the typical church that lets you put in the money into the little pouches and pass it on – they make you put the money into envelopes, then you put it into the pouches.

I didn’t think too much about it at first, but slowly I began to question – “Why was there this need?” Honestly it just didn’t make sense to spend money printing envelopes with the logos, etc. And the manpower spent inserting those envelopes to every newsletter (granted free labour, anyway).

Then one day I thought to myself, “It just seems like they want to obligate you to give. You were given a wrapping for a present; so therefore you feel you ought to give the present. It is also a way to monitor how much an average person gives during service. So why is there this obligation when it’s supposed to be freewill?”

So the next service, I tried something out – I didn’t give an offering. Oh, badass! :D

looked at me when I just passed the pouch over, asking me why didn’t I give an offering. I said I have no more money left for the week, so can’t give anymore. After which, she gave a very disapproving glare.

After service at fellowship (dinner), the cell group leader requested to speak to me. He said he was informed that I didn’t give an offering because I had no more money left. Then he told me it was my duty to put aside money for God every week, it was to show God my love and sincerity in worshipping Him.

HAHAHA! Okay, I’m sorry. Right now I’m just laughing at how pathetic it sounds. But he really did say that! And at that age, I actually thought I did something gravely wrong to God. I failed to realise that it was between me & God.

The following week onwards, they monitored if I gave offerings closely. Even with the friendly reminder before service started.

Second, tithings.

Somewhere in the bible it says something about giving God 10% of your fortune or harvest… Truthfully quite vague about this. I just know the 10%.

So then every month, you’re supposed to give 10% of your salary/allowance to the church – on top of offerings.

“Whatever you have, actually belongs to God. Even your money. But God is so magnanimous that He only wants 10% of it.” Remember those words crystal clear.

So like I said, I didn’t grow up in a happy home. Sometimes my remaining parent would not give me money or take what little savings I had – sometimes I had no money to even eat. Therefore giving away 10% was asking a lot of me.

And on those envelopes that give you for offerings are forms as well. There you will fill up your name, cell group number, contact number and amount you are giving for your tithe.

Yes, they monitor your tithings.

So quite a few times my cell group leader said he was notified that I didn’t give my tithing for this month, or my tithing seemed significantly lesser than usual.

Again – I bought into it and felt like I could do better for God. I failed to realise I wasn’t chasing God; I was stupidly chasing their approval for God knows what reason.

Third, pledging monies.

Everyone should know more or less that the church has building funds. I was there when they just moved to the church in Jurong, near NTU. It was entirely brand new, nice facilities with obviously pricey construction. “Nothing but the best for God,” they said.

Then before I knew it, they had new ideas to build a stadium of some sort. Citing the rapid growth of church members as a reason. There was about a 20 to 30 minute speech on how we should contribute to building the house of God.

Nice words, eh? House of God. So of course I’d want to help! Pledge money that I rely on getting occasionally from concerned relatives? Sure!

What an idiot I was.

And the best part was that they even set a benchmark of how much they encouraged each church member to give. If I remember correctly, it was about $200 a month.

My mentor even sat down with me to plan out how I can somehow give $200 every month – on top of 10% tithing and very compulsory offering… to build the house of God.

Then I started to think, “Am I just here to give them free money; buying the illusion of a family that I crave for?”

Fourth, God the investment banker.

Every time before offering, we were told this – if you give to God, God will give you back 10 times.

So even if you do not have much money, just give what little you have… And somehow God will multiply it and give it back to you.

They preached that God wants all of us to be rich. And also that “where your treasure is, there your heart will be also”. So therefore – to show your sincere love to God, you must give him your money.

I tried asking what if my treasure isn’t money? Then they said, “The bible meant money.”

Fifth, bringing in new people.

Every week we are expected to always bring in new people to service. ALWAYS expected to.

They even presented charts of who brought in new people and who didn’t. Those who didn’t were mildly humiliated, of course.

But it was really difficult and rather ironic. When I had too many close friends outside church, they were unhappy and told me that it was ungodly influence. I should surround myself with spiritual people.

Oh, but still must have a good enough relationship with these non-spiritual people to convince them to come to a religious event.

There was this time my mentor called another cell group member and myself to her house. There, she sat us both down and made us call each and every person on our handphone contact list – asking them to come to church. ‘No’ is not an answer.

If they were sick, we’d give a mask. If they were not free, plan the following weekend or the next. If they were not willing, ask why until they couldn’t give a legit reason.

I don’t know how many people I pissed off, how many friends I lost that day… but I know that month my phone bill was really high. :( And those people I called became even more guarded against anything to do with Christianity.

When we didn’t manage to get people, she scolded us. When I said this isn’t the right thing to do, she said I was being selfish and not sharing salvation. When my cell group member managed to get someone, they both said I didn’t care about this hard enough.

Then I asked, “What’s the point of bringing in people who are unwilling? Won’t this just shut their hearts to God even more when you force them like this?”

Needless to say, I was rebuked for not having child-like faith.

Sixth, accountability.

Basically what happened here was my mentor was to be kept informed of my whereabouts at all times.

After school, what I was doing… Who I’m hanging out with… It was a tad invasive.

And I wasn’t allowed to meet boys. Other church members in the school were to tell immediately if any of us did something the church won’t approve of.

I was in a girls’ school, but somehow I still got to know boys through friends or sometimes the Internet. However I wasn’t allowed to go out with boys because they do not approve of it. And according to them, I cannot start dating till I turned 21.

And when I asked the cell group leader, “Then why did you start dating your girlfriend at 16?” I was rebuked and told not to question my leader.

There was once I met this boy after school for a movie, it was supposed to be with another girl but she had to go home. So it was just the both of us. A cell group member in school saw and immediately informed our mentor, of which I quickly got a phone call to ask me what in the world I was doing.

Next service, I was rebuked again and I actually felt guilty for it even though I knew clearly he and I were just good friends.

I tried reasoning with my mentor that it didn’t start out this way, that the other girl was suddenly called to go home.

“Oh what a coincidence. How do I know that you’re speaking the truth? You always had boys, so maybe this was your way to go on a date. If it really wasn’t a date, you would’ve left when the other girl left as well. You don’t respect yourself.”

Seventh, buying Sun Ho’s albums.

Ah, everyone’s favourite.

So our pastor’s wife wanted to enter the music industry to preach the Word of God. Using songs to lead the people honestly didn’t sound like a bad idea.

Then it got to her albums. Every single person in church had to have her album. It was compulsory, really. If you didn’t have her album, then you don’t love your church family. And back then we still used portable CD players. Everyone was supposed to have the CD in their bags.

It seemed quite ridiculous to me at this point. Especially when they pushed us to buy several albums at service. Yes, several copies of the exact same album. Why? To give Sun Ho the support to spread the Word of God.

Everyone had to buy at least 3 to 5 albums. Cell group members collected money from the members to buy the albums. And told them to give the albums to other people to spread the Word.

Slowly, the number of albums each church member had to buy was increasing. Pastors and cell group leaders kept on pushing and pressurising everyone to buy the albums. It got to a point whereby another cell group member actually sold his car in order to buy more albums.

Eighth, Sun Ho’s crossovers.

True to her word, she did go overseas and preached the gospel through her concerts. She would sing some songs, share her testimony and call on people to receive Jesus as their one true saviour.

Every now and then we were shown numbers of souls she saved – tens of thousands at a time.

Then I asked, “Do these people have a church to go to, to continue building their relationship with God?”

“Not sure. We already shared the Word with them. It’s up to them now.”

“But without a spiritually supportive environment it’s easy to lose faith. Won’t they then be condemned to hell for knowing the Word but not believing in it?”

Yup. Got rebuked again.

Ninth, outcasting.

Back then there was a man (yes, Mr Roland Poon) who told the public about the church forcing members to buy Sun Ho’s albums, of which he was fiercely dealt with in church. His cell group leader and mentor rebuked him to no end, his cell group members ostracised him.

Of which then he was pressured to give a public apology to the church and was definitely treated differently. And to give due credit, Kong Hee did announce in service to forgive and accept him back.

However this social outcasting happened to me when I started asking questions. I started mentally calculating how much money the church was making (10% tithe + offerings of $2 at a conservative amount of per pax), it gave me a rather high number. After thinking through it all, I realised every month the church should have a bit of money left after operational costs. Then why did they constantly ask for money all the time? So how much were they paying the pastors? What else are they spending on? Shouldn’t the leftover money be put into the church’s own building fund, instead of asking for more from the people? Wasn’t the money given to God, for God’s people?

They also showed how well Sun Ho was doing overseas – claiming she was popular in Taiwan and America. Showing us hit charts where she was #1. To me, if she was so popular… Then why did the church make everyone buy about 9-12 albums each to support her? So with the help of the Internet, I went to look around. Only to find that every weekend I was buying into a scam. I chatted up some Americans on IRC and asked about Sun Ho, where 100% response I got was along the lines of, “Who the f**k is that?”

They said the money goes to God. Fantastic. So tell me, do you actually give the money to God? I’m sure our Earthly money means to nothing to Him, who is in Heaven. So if you don’t actually give the money to God… What on Earth do you spend on that you deem worthy enough to be ‘God’?

It was just downright ludicrous.

If they did things the public disapproved of, they’ll say that Jesus also faced this and they need to move on. The devil was fighting against them. Resistance meant they were doing the right thing.

If they did things the public approved of, they’ll shout Hallelujah and how they are bringing God to the world.

In full honesty, they did very good marketing right there. They brainwashed the people into believing every single thing they did, no matter what other facts might state. The people in the church aren’t the bad guys – they were just steered the wrong direction.

To me, I saw the devil doing an excellent job there. I saw so many people leave and strongly shutting their hearts away from the very idea of God. And I saw how those people in church don’t worship God; they worship Kong Hee and the prosperity gospel they’re fed.

Feeling frustrated and powerless, I left and prayed, “God, if You do exist – please save these people.”

I’m thankful for the strength Mr Roland Poon found to stand up for what he believes in, despite all the opposing forces. And I’m glad that at least there’s a little justice out there.

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Then one day I thought to myself, “It just seems like they want to obligate you to give. You were given a wrapping for a present; so therefore you feel you ought to give the present. It is also a way to monitor how much an average person gives during service. So why is there this obligation when it’s supposed to be freewill?”

.... If they did things the public disapproved of, they’ll say that Jesus also faced this and they need to move on. The devil was fighting against them. Resistance meant they were doing the right thing..

I am sorry for what the poster went through. But it is utterly typical of many of these so-called charismatic churches in many parts of the world. They prey on innocents who have a void in their lives n then they turn the screw tighter n tighter. Ur actions r monitored n then they use the tactics of the bully to humiliate n degrade u.

Question their actions n u become a disciple of the devil. The devil is always a key part of their plan coz without a devil they cannot justify their own rapacious n immoral acts.

The maddening thing is these charlatans often get special tax exempt staus. I hope so much the Singapore authorities use this case to tighten up their regulations n examine closely each n every "church" to insist on formal annual audits of both their practices n their finances.

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9 Reasons Why City Harvest Church Was the Devil To Me

http://gerashen.com/2015/10/22/8-reasons-why-city-harvest-church-was-the-devil-to-me/

Harvest people – but through my years I’ve learnt that all they know is to spout out loud their blinded ‘opinions’.

People: They’re not opinions if you were brainwashed into it; that just makes it an influence over a weak mind.

I dare say this.

Why? Because I was one of them.

It was quite a number of years back, when I was still in secondary school. To be honest, I didn’t grow up in a happy home and endless hopes of getting out of my abyss was just part of my daily routine. While there were others who asked me to join their ‘gangs’, I didn’t want my daddy to look down from Heaven and be disappointed that he didn’t live long enough to love & protect me.

Soon enough I was invited to City Harvest Church and was quite intrigued by their style of worship. At that time, Charismatic churches weren’t very well-known in Singapore. So when songs had strong beats, fast rhythms and people grooving to them – it all seemed really new.

And deep down I wanted to believe that maybe, just maybe… They were the family that I lost. Oh, how stupid I was.

It wasn’t too long before the whole hype of their music tuned down a little and other ugly things started to sprout.

Disclaimer: Whatever I share here is entirely my own experiences and from my perspective, which can be limited. So if you experienced anything otherwise or feel that I’m spouting nonsense – you’re welcome to leave. Thank you.

First, I’ll start with offerings.

Quite a norm of the church, yes? So unlike the typical church that lets you put in the money into the little pouches and pass it on – they make you put the money into envelopes, then you put it into the pouches.

I didn’t think too much about it at first, but slowly I began to question – “Why was there this need?” Honestly it just didn’t make sense to spend money printing envelopes with the logos, etc. And the manpower spent inserting those envelopes to every newsletter (granted free labour, anyway).

Then one day I thought to myself, “It just seems like they want to obligate you to give. You were given a wrapping for a present; so therefore you feel you ought to give the present. It is also a way to monitor how much an average person gives during service. So why is there this obligation when it’s supposed to be freewill?”

So the next service, I tried something out – I didn’t give an offering. Oh, badass! :D

looked at me when I just passed the pouch over, asking me why didn’t I give an offering. I said I have no more money left for the week, so can’t give anymore. After which, she gave a very disapproving glare.

After service at fellowship (dinner), the cell group leader requested to speak to me. He said he was informed that I didn’t give an offering because I had no more money left. Then he told me it was my duty to put aside money for God every week, it was to show God my love and sincerity in worshipping Him.

HAHAHA! Okay, I’m sorry. Right now I’m just laughing at how pathetic it sounds. But he really did say that! And at that age, I actually thought I did something gravely wrong to God. I failed to realise that it was between me & God.

The following week onwards, they monitored if I gave offerings closely. Even with the friendly reminder before service started.

Second, tithings.

Somewhere in the bible it says something about giving God 10% of your fortune or harvest… Truthfully quite vague about this. I just know the 10%.

So then every month, you’re supposed to give 10% of your salary/allowance to the church – on top of offerings.

“Whatever you have, actually belongs to God. Even your money. But God is so magnanimous that He only wants 10% of it.” Remember those words crystal clear.

So like I said, I didn’t grow up in a happy home. Sometimes my remaining parent would not give me money or take what little savings I had – sometimes I had no money to even eat. Therefore giving away 10% was asking a lot of me.

And on those envelopes that give you for offerings are forms as well. There you will fill up your name, cell group number, contact number and amount you are giving for your tithe.

Yes, they monitor your tithings.

So quite a few times my cell group leader said he was notified that I didn’t give my tithing for this month, or my tithing seemed significantly lesser than usual.

Again – I bought into it and felt like I could do better for God. I failed to realise I wasn’t chasing God; I was stupidly chasing their approval for God knows what reason.

Third, pledging monies.

Everyone should know more or less that the church has building funds. I was there when they just moved to the church in Jurong, near NTU. It was entirely brand new, nice facilities with obviously pricey construction. “Nothing but the best for God,” they said.

Then before I knew it, they had new ideas to build a stadium of some sort. Citing the rapid growth of church members as a reason. There was about a 20 to 30 minute speech on how we should contribute to building the house of God.

Nice words, eh? House of God. So of course I’d want to help! Pledge money that I rely on getting occasionally from concerned relatives? Sure!

What an idiot I was.

And the best part was that they even set a benchmark of how much they encouraged each church member to give. If I remember correctly, it was about $200 a month.

My mentor even sat down with me to plan out how I can somehow give $200 every month – on top of 10% tithing and very compulsory offering… to build the house of God.

Then I started to think, “Am I just here to give them free money; buying the illusion of a family that I crave for?”

Fourth, God the investment banker.

Every time before offering, we were told this – if you give to God, God will give you back 10 times.

So even if you do not have much money, just give what little you have… And somehow God will multiply it and give it back to you.

They preached that God wants all of us to be rich. And also that “where your treasure is, there your heart will be also”. So therefore – to show your sincere love to God, you must give him your money.

I tried asking what if my treasure isn’t money? Then they said, “The bible meant money.”

Fifth, bringing in new people.

Every week we are expected to always bring in new people to service. ALWAYS expected to.

They even presented charts of who brought in new people and who didn’t. Those who didn’t were mildly humiliated, of course.

But it was really difficult and rather ironic. When I had too many close friends outside church, they were unhappy and told me that it was ungodly influence. I should surround myself with spiritual people.

Oh, but still must have a good enough relationship with these non-spiritual people to convince them to come to a religious event.

There was this time my mentor called another cell group member and myself to her house. There, she sat us both down and made us call each and every person on our handphone contact list – asking them to come to church. ‘No’ is not an answer.

If they were sick, we’d give a mask. If they were not free, plan the following weekend or the next. If they were not willing, ask why until they couldn’t give a legit reason.

I don’t know how many people I pissed off, how many friends I lost that day… but I know that month my phone bill was really high. :( And those people I called became even more guarded against anything to do with Christianity.

When we didn’t manage to get people, she scolded us. When I said this isn’t the right thing to do, she said I was being selfish and not sharing salvation. When my cell group member managed to get someone, they both said I didn’t care about this hard enough.

Then I asked, “What’s the point of bringing in people who are unwilling? Won’t this just shut their hearts to God even more when you force them like this?”

Needless to say, I was rebuked for not having child-like faith.

Sixth, accountability.

Basically what happened here was my mentor was to be kept informed of my whereabouts at all times.

After school, what I was doing… Who I’m hanging out with… It was a tad invasive.

And I wasn’t allowed to meet boys. Other church members in the school were to tell immediately if any of us did something the church won’t approve of.

I was in a girls’ school, but somehow I still got to know boys through friends or sometimes the Internet. However I wasn’t allowed to go out with boys because they do not approve of it. And according to them, I cannot start dating till I turned 21.

And when I asked the cell group leader, “Then why did you start dating your girlfriend at 16?” I was rebuked and told not to question my leader.

There was once I met this boy after school for a movie, it was supposed to be with another girl but she had to go home. So it was just the both of us. A cell group member in school saw and immediately informed our mentor, of which I quickly got a phone call to ask me what in the world I was doing.

Next service, I was rebuked again and I actually felt guilty for it even though I knew clearly he and I were just good friends.

I tried reasoning with my mentor that it didn’t start out this way, that the other girl was suddenly called to go home.

“Oh what a coincidence. How do I know that you’re speaking the truth? You always had boys, so maybe this was your way to go on a date. If it really wasn’t a date, you would’ve left when the other girl left as well. You don’t respect yourself.”

Seventh, buying Sun Ho’s albums.

Ah, everyone’s favourite.

So our pastor’s wife wanted to enter the music industry to preach the Word of God. Using songs to lead the people honestly didn’t sound like a bad idea.

Then it got to her albums. Every single person in church had to have her album. It was compulsory, really. If you didn’t have her album, then you don’t love your church family. And back then we still used portable CD players. Everyone was supposed to have the CD in their bags.

It seemed quite ridiculous to me at this point. Especially when they pushed us to buy several albums at service. Yes, several copies of the exact same album. Why? To give Sun Ho the support to spread the Word of God.

Everyone had to buy at least 3 to 5 albums. Cell group members collected money from the members to buy the albums. And told them to give the albums to other people to spread the Word.

Slowly, the number of albums each church member had to buy was increasing. Pastors and cell group leaders kept on pushing and pressurising everyone to buy the albums. It got to a point whereby another cell group member actually sold his car in order to buy more albums.

Eighth, Sun Ho’s crossovers.

True to her word, she did go overseas and preached the gospel through her concerts. She would sing some songs, share her testimony and call on people to receive Jesus as their one true saviour.

Every now and then we were shown numbers of souls she saved – tens of thousands at a time.

Then I asked, “Do these people have a church to go to, to continue building their relationship with God?”

“Not sure. We already shared the Word with them. It’s up to them now.”

“But without a spiritually supportive environment it’s easy to lose faith. Won’t they then be condemned to hell for knowing the Word but not believing in it?”

Yup. Got rebuked again.

Ninth, outcasting.

Back then there was a man (yes, Mr Roland Poon) who told the public about the church forcing members to buy Sun Ho’s albums, of which he was fiercely dealt with in church. His cell group leader and mentor rebuked him to no end, his cell group members ostracised him.

Of which then he was pressured to give a public apology to the church and was definitely treated differently. And to give due credit, Kong Hee did announce in service to forgive and accept him back.

However this social outcasting happened to me when I started asking questions. I started mentally calculating how much money the church was making (10% tithe + offerings of $2 at a conservative amount of per pax), it gave me a rather high number. After thinking through it all, I realised every month the church should have a bit of money left after operational costs. Then why did they constantly ask for money all the time? So how much were they paying the pastors? What else are they spending on? Shouldn’t the leftover money be put into the church’s own building fund, instead of asking for more from the people? Wasn’t the money given to God, for God’s people?

They also showed how well Sun Ho was doing overseas – claiming she was popular in Taiwan and America. Showing us hit charts where she was #1. To me, if she was so popular… Then why did the church make everyone buy about 9-12 albums each to support her? So with the help of the Internet, I went to look around. Only to find that every weekend I was buying into a scam. I chatted up some Americans on IRC and asked about Sun Ho, where 100% response I got was along the lines of, “Who the f**k is that?”

They said the money goes to God. Fantastic. So tell me, do you actually give the money to God? I’m sure our Earthly money means to nothing to Him, who is in Heaven. So if you don’t actually give the money to God… What on Earth do you spend on that you deem worthy enough to be ‘God’?

It was just downright ludicrous.

If they did things the public disapproved of, they’ll say that Jesus also faced this and they need to move on. The devil was fighting against them. Resistance meant they were doing the right thing.

If they did things the public approved of, they’ll shout Hallelujah and how they are bringing God to the world.

In full honesty, they did very good marketing right there. They brainwashed the people into believing every single thing they did, no matter what other facts might state. The people in the church aren’t the bad guys – they were just steered the wrong direction.

To me, I saw the devil doing an excellent job there. I saw so many people leave and strongly shutting their hearts away from the very idea of God. And I saw how those people in church don’t worship God; they worship Kong Hee and the prosperity gospel they’re fed.

Feeling frustrated and powerless, I left and prayed, “God, if You do exist – please save these people.”

I’m thankful for the strength Mr Roland Poon found to stand up for what he believes in, despite all the opposing forces. And I’m glad that at least there’s a little justice out there.

 

my sentiment exactly. u r not alone. u have left. that's the good news!

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Most expensive court case in the history of Singapore?

Fight no further. Safe it for more meaningful purpose. Submit to God and be a good pastor after serving sentence. God is most forgiving.

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你信什么教?

 

After this mammoth case of misappropriating church funds, why are there still "believers"?

Don't the staunch believers realise that their leaders are mere "false" prophets?

I am not surprised that more dirty laundry will be exposed ... 

God, please help those lost sheep..

 

还是, 信“睡觉” 就比较“安全”。。。

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你信什么教?

 

After this mammoth case of misappropriating church funds, why are there still "believers"?

Don't the staunch believers realise that their leaders are mere "false" prophets?

I am not surprised that more dirty laundry will be exposed ... 

God, please help those lost sheep..

 

还是, 信“睡觉” 就比较“安全”。。。

 

你信什么教?

 

After this mammoth case of misappropriating church funds, why are there still "believers"?

Don't the staunch believers realise that their leaders are mere "false" prophets?

I am not surprised that more dirty laundry will be exposed ... 

God, please help those lost sheep..

 

还是, 信“睡觉” 就比较“安全”。。。

 

It is called Stokholme's Syndrome. Even if Pastor Kong Hee goes and kang kang this people to sodomize them, they will do it willingly. 

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It's not just Stockholm Syndrome, it's pure emotional blackmail and harassment already.

 

Add to this the horrible feelings these "obedient sheep of the Men of God" must be having when they realize they have been duped so miserably, they have been such suckers.

So it is understandable that they will fight this reality with tooth and nail, and plead with God to come and help them rescue their Men of God.  Maybe divine intervention could help the six crooks and restore their glory if they pray long and strong enough in their "City Harvest Cash" church ?

 

Their Stockholm Syndrome didn't prevent them from contributing to the bashing of LGTBs in the most un-Christian way.

If the scandal would not have broken loose they may be now feeling happy and superior bashing the LGTBs for our "abominations".

Edited by Steve5380
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I (really) can't wait for the official sentencing... Put the 6 of them behind bars for many years .. so many, that Ah Hong's wife needs to go for multiple plastic surgery when he is released...  Hopefully, they will serve each count of guilt consecutively and not concurrently. 

 

Seriously, I lost "faith" in churches since the late 80s when I had a brief association with another church.  My "welcome" was short-lived.  It was nightmarish by the end of the first week.  They monitored my movements - time with the other members were more important than my own family.    I earned a decent income and I was reprimanded for my "expensive" taste - in clothes, in shoes, in bags.. I ought to give the money to the church instead of spending it on moi..

 

Unfortunately, I lived 2 streets away and there was no excuse for transport or traffic woes.    I left after I was confronted by an elder over my homosexual behaviour.  Actually, during that short 3 months with them, I stopped masturbation and sex.. .. so I was cleansed by the Holy Spirit but then again, I would rather be "sinful" than having to cover my tracks all the time.  

 

宗教要人学真, 善, 美。。无私。。不受外界影响。。纯洁,向极乐世界前进。。。

但是, 这世界又太复杂。。假道士太多。。。

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I (really) can't wait for the official sentencing... Put the 6 of them behind bars for many years .. so many, that Ah Hong's wife needs to go for multiple plastic surgery when he is released...  Hopefully, they will serve each count of guilt consecutively and not concurrently. 

 

Seriously, I lost "faith" in churches since the late 80s when I had a brief association with another church.  My "welcome" was short-lived.  It was nightmarish by the end of the first week.  They monitored my movements - time with the other members were more important than my own family.    I earned a decent income and I was reprimanded for my "expensive" taste - in clothes, in shoes, in bags.. I ought to give the money to the church instead of spending it on moi..

 

Unfortunately, I lived 2 streets away and there was no excuse for transport or traffic woes.    I left after I was confronted by an elder over my homosexual behaviour.  Actually, during that short 3 months with them, I stopped masturbation and sex.. .. so I was cleansed by the Holy Spirit but then again, I would rather be "sinful" than having to cover my tracks all the time.  

 

宗教要人学真, 善, 美。。无私。。不受外界影响。。纯洁,向极乐世界前进。。。

但是, 这世界又太复杂。。假道士太多。。。

 

No way should any religion dictate your way of living, it's quite sad to hear what that 'church' did to you.

Instagram: vodkabaker

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Its more than just unsubtle blackmail. I reckon it is far more the constant almost daily preying on individuals to make them feel guilty. Thus ppl continuously feel unworthy n the only way they can redeem themselves is by doing what these so-called "pastors" instruct them to do. As bodybuildMLY says, its an insidious form of hard sell hypnotisation that makes ppl do what in their more rational moments they would not do. The longer they submit to this crap, the more hooked they become n the more they believe it. Its a form of addiction that shld be banned.

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Guest Kurt Yonoyono Calbista

Only 25% loss of membership, which mean 75/100 still believe in the ministries of Pastor kong hee ,and. Pastor Sun. My family have registered me for baptism at Chc next month. This episode calls for greater unity of what has been published in always one sided.

My parents till now are great supporters and fan of Sun Ho and Pastor Kong. The current situation did not deter them. I had a quarrel with them and fall out with my family. My dad threatened to disown me if I do not support CHC and Pastor's current ' tribulation of God's Ministry, liken to be the Great works of Satan being blamed for such current situation.

I am suppposed to be in USA soon for further education , now my expenses are cut off if I do not obey them and they used the 10 commandments to curse upon me.

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Guest Goldman

In conservative Singapore, what will tear the fabric of the self-righteous yet vulnerable society is the 2 opposite camps of homosexuals and christians fundamentalists.  Both groups are getting stronger with increased education, exposure and stubborness.

 

Good luck to Singapore.

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Only 25% loss of membership, which mean 75/100 still believe in the ministries of Pastor kong hee ,and. Pastor Sun. My family have registered me for baptism at Chc next month. This episode calls for greater unity of what has been published in always one sided.

My parents till now are great supporters and fan of Sun Ho and Pastor Kong. The current situation did not deter them. I had a quarrel with them and fall out with my family. My dad threatened to disown me if I do not support CHC and Pastor's current ' tribulation of God's Ministry, liken to be the Great works of Satan being blamed for such current situation.

I am suppposed to be in USA soon for further education , now my expenses are cut off if I do not obey them and they used the 10 commandments to curse upon me.

Don't risk your education. Maybe you may wanna think about faking this whole thing for a while. You'll be going to the US soon anyway. And once you're back (with your degree), you'll be financially independent and free.

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Most defenders of CHC, online or offline, tend to cite how much CHC, or should I say "Pastor Kong" has helped them.

 

I wouldn't challenge the veracity of this. But I do wonder whether these folks have given any serious contemplation to their journeys. In practically all cases, what they suffered from was a lack of acceptance. For example, a family that doesn't care. Schoolmates who bully. Stalemate at work etc. CHC, with its "brothers and sisters" environment, mutual praising, hugs and kisses and everything, fulfilled that social need.

 

At a cost that is. A massive cost in the form of tithes, free manpower, free presence (at all events), free promotion, free campaigning and what else have you. Oh yes, nowadays, queuing overnight at trials too.

 

Honestly, the total amount of time and money contributed, wouldn't this folks have not gotten similar help elsewhere. Heck, in some cases, you could probably hire a professional shrink, or a small team of therapists. Or maybe they could have even gotten it for free by going to proper government bodies. Kong Hee and gang have cunningly made them pay for their own therapies without them knowing. And they still continue to pay.

 

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Only 25% loss of membership, which mean 75/100 still believe in the ministries of Pastor kong hee ,and. Pastor Sun. My family have registered me for baptism at Chc next month. This episode calls for greater unity of what has been published in always one sided.

My parents till now are great supporters and fan of Sun Ho and Pastor Kong. The current situation did not deter them. I had a quarrel with them and fall out with my family. My dad threatened to disown me if I do not support CHC and Pastor's current ' tribulation of God's Ministry, liken to be the Great works of Satan being blamed for such current situation.

I am suppposed to be in USA soon for further education , now my expenses are cut off if I do not obey them and they used the 10 commandments to curse upon me.

wtf? just go for the baptism la. you will be gone from singapore soon anyways. 

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Only 25% loss of membership, which mean 75/100 still believe in the ministries of Pastor kong hee ,and. Pastor Sun. My family have registered me for baptism at Chc next month. This episode calls for greater unity of what has been published in always one sided.

My parents till now are great supporters and fan of Sun Ho and Pastor Kong. The current situation did not deter them. I had a quarrel with them and fall out with my family. My dad threatened to disown me if I do not support CHC and Pastor's current ' tribulation of God's Ministry, liken to be the Great works of Satan being blamed for such current situation.

I am suppposed to be in USA soon for further education , now my expenses are cut off if I do not obey them and they used the 10 commandments to curse upon me.

 

I concur with all the previous comments about your situation.

Let the wealth of your parents be used in a noble cause for a change, and put up with CHC so that you can get a great education in the US.

Once you accomplish this, THEN dedicate your efforts to de-hypnotize your family from the deceptive CHC and bring them back to reality.

They may be thankful to you for doing it, and for having used their wealth in a positive way.

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i think these CHC supporters, after decades of brain-washing, are the "gone cases".... nothing will bring their senses back.

 

they are like the walking dead... walking, eating but not capable of thinking anymore.

Edited by mith
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What do you mean she is still nowhere?? Where have you been, under a rock?

She was the first Asian singer to top the Billboard Charts, not once, not twice, but 5 times! Even Korea's Wonder Girls didn't manage such a Guinness feat.

Why then albums can't sell until church need to force members to buy and bought with church money leh
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Guest snowball

要固执盲目的信徒承认自己一直以来所相信的崇拜的原来只是一个假象泡影,就有如在自己脸上刮了一巴掌,是多么丢脸的一件事,这也是证明自己多无知,就算是错也要错到底,这不就是人性丑陋的另一面吗? 苦海无涯,又有几人能真正回岸呢?

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Guest Guest too

From Sentosa $10m penthouse to Changi Hilton in a few months time. Justice is served.

 

Hello people, what is your problem????  The Oceanfront $10 million penthouse is not fully Kong Hee's. It is con-owned with Indonesian tycoon Wahju Hanafi. The monthly instalment is a very very modest sum of $17,000.  Surely Kong Hee is capable of spending such small sum of money.  We all know his wife is internationally renowned and he is CHC #1.  They both live a very hectic life and they deserve a good night rest and a place truly called home.  Dont you all agree with me?  Oceanfront is the perfect haven for this beautiful and successful couple.  They deserve our blessing!  

 

Come!!!  let us all applaud and wish he could fully own this $10 million home!  May he and Sun have bigger homes to own in the future.

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要固执盲目的信徒承认自己一直以来所相信的崇拜的原来只是一个假象泡影,就有如在自己脸上刮了一巴掌,是多么丢脸的一件事,这也是证明自己多无知,就算是错也要错到底,这不就是人性丑陋的另一面吗? 苦海无涯,又有几人能真正回岸呢?

 

snowball, 不要乱讲!他们很有本事,很厉害!你瞧!他们过着神仙般的生活,吃香喝辣!穿金戴银!名牌包包、衣裳、配件、轿车、豪宅!好神气!好有派头!好拉风!好牛!好神!想出唱片嘛,老娘金口一开,就一定大卖!想交担保金100万吧,就马上缴付,眉头都不皱一下的!小菜一碟!

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i think these CHC supporters, after decades of brain-washing, are the "gone cases".... nothing will bring their senses back.

they are like the walking dead... walking, eating but not capable of thinking anymore.

i think these CHC supporters, after decades of brain-washing, are the "gone cases".... nothing will bring their senses back.

they are like the walking dead... walking, eating but not capable of thinking anymore.

I've seen them before. Couples who date that seem together only because one man one woman is legitimate christian couple, no chemistry, no passion and on top of that they seem so dreadfully bored of each other. Zombies indeed. Gone cases liao. Many years already still like that. They are stuck with holy christians one another. God bless them. Amen!
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要固执盲目的信徒承认自己一直以来所相信的崇拜的原来只是一个假象泡影,就有如在自己脸上刮了一巴掌,是多么丢脸的一件事,这也是证明自己多无知,就算是错也要错到底,这不就是人性丑陋的另一面吗? 苦海无涯,又有几人能真正回岸呢?

执迷不悔

词/王靖雯 曲/袁惟仁

这一次我执著面对 任性地沉醉

我并不在乎 这是错还是对

就算是深陷 我不顾一切

就算是执迷 我也执迷不悔

别说我应该放弃 应该睁开眼

我用我的心 去看~去感觉

你并不是我 又怎能了解

就算是执迷~ 就让我执迷不悔

我不是你们想得如此完美

我承认有时也会辨不清真伪

并非我不愿意走出迷堆

只是这一次

这次是自己而不是谁

要我用谁的心去体会

真真切切的感受周围

就算痛苦 就算是泪

也是属於我的伤悲

我还能用谁的心去体会

真真切切地感受周围

就算疲倦 就算是累

只能执迷~而不悔

歌手:王菲

专辑:《执迷不悔》

这次我重头面对

过去和以后

人如何自欺

再不管这对否

人如何不舍

也放开所有

从堕入深清

完全不想悔疚

我决意沉迷下去

放眼迎以后

人寻求自尊

你心感觉否

人如何长久

却了解不够

从独自飞走

完全不想悔疚

身边的声音祝福我的一切

我已听厌你说我那样美丽

若付在旧日子不再可贵

我说我这次

要痛快有我的依归

今天且忍心一声再会

不须伤心风中依偎

勉强与你

到度张望会

在热烈后变飞灰

今天且忍心笑笑干杯

可知一天我会荡回

你从会说已早改变

独自梦下去都不悔

我决意沉迷下去

放眼迎以后

人寻求自尊

你心感觉否

人如何长久

却了解不够

从独自飞走

完全不想悔疚

身边的声音祝福我的一切

我已听厌你说我那样美丽

若付在旧日子不再可贵

我说我这次

要痛快有我的依归

今天且忍心一声再会

不须伤心风中依偎

勉强与你

到度张望会

在热烈后变飞灰

今天且忍心笑笑干杯

可知一天我会荡回

你从会说已早改变

独自梦下去都不悔

今天且忍心一声再会

不须伤心风中依偎

勉强与你

到度张望会

在热烈后变飞灰

今天且忍心笑笑干杯

可知一天我会荡回

你从会说已早改变

独自梦下去都不悔

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Hello people, what is your problem????  The Oceanfront $10 million penthouse is not fully Kong Hee's. It is con-owned with Indonesian tycoon Wahju Hanafi. The monthly instalment is a very very modest sum of $17,000.  Surely Kong Hee is capable of spending such small sum of money.  We all know his wife is internationally renowned and he is CHC #1.  They both live a very hectic life and they deserve a good night rest and a place truly called home.  Dont you all agree with me?  Oceanfront is the perfect haven for this beautiful and successful couple.  They deserve our blessing!  

 

Come!!!  let us all applaud and wish he could fully own this $10 million home!  May he and Sun have bigger homes to own in the future.

 

炒你的果条!FXXK YOU DEEP DEEP!

 

$17,000 monthly is a modest sum of money! a small sum of money to devil kong and his witch wife! FXXK YOU!!!

almost 1/5 of singapore citizens only earn that amount in a YEAR! 

 

crook kong and his desperate-for-fame talentless bitch lead a hectic life style and deserve a sentosa cove condo for a good night sleep! FXXK YOU! FXXK YOU! FXXK YOU!

which hard working average citizen don't have a hectic life!

 

a bigger place for these 2 money-hunger sleazly scum-of-the-earth to truly call home! 

they are already on a one way express train to HELL! its an endless space of burning fire there for them to eternally called HOME! 

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炒你的果条!FXXK YOU DEEP DEEP!

$17,000 monthly is a modest sum of money! a small sum of money to devil kong and his witch wife! FXXK YOU!!!

almost 1/5 of singapore citizens only earn that amount in a YEAR!

crook kong and his desperate-for-fame talentless bitch lead a hectic life style and deserve a sentosa cove condo for a good night sleep! FXXK YOU! FXXK YOU! FXXK YOU!

which hard working average citizen don't have a hectic life!

a bigger place for these 2 money-hunger sleazly scum-of-the-earth to truly call home!

they are already on a one way express train to HELL! its an endless space of burning fire there for them to eternally called HOME!

Aiyah those "pastas" think they "messenger of god" mah... So deserved the best of the best. Self delusion led to temptation, will is not strong enough to resist so give in all the way. Being a "pasta" is dangerous indeed for people with proclivity for taking huge risks, enormous greed and ambition and little resolve to resist temptations, those who may end up on jail like them.
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The Woman at the center of all this has not been charged with anything. :blink:

 

ST reported today ("Kong Hee tells church members: Pastor is sorry") that She thanked the congregation at CHC. 

 

What she meant is this:

 

"Thank you for being here, for being courageous clueless and supportive submissive. Thank you for your love money. It has made a difference for all of us and our family members. Thank you, thank you, thank you." :clap: 

Edited by Latte

 

 

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Hello people, what is your problem????  The Oceanfront $10 million penthouse is not fully Kong Hee's. It is con-owned with Indonesian tycoon Wahju Hanafi. The monthly instalment is a very very modest sum of $17,000.  Surely Kong Hee is capable of spending such small sum of money.  We all know his wife is internationally renowned and he is CHC #1.  They both live a very hectic life and they deserve a good night rest and a place truly called home.  Dont you all agree with me?  Oceanfront is the perfect haven for this beautiful and successful couple.  They deserve our blessing!  

 

Come!!!  let us all applaud and wish he could fully own this $10 million home!  May he and Sun have bigger homes to own in the future.

 

Change prison cost more and is bigger. They can live there together.

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The devil in me ..

 

 

Now perhaps we don't need a BSc/MBA/PhD anymore...

Just be a preacher man... just God's words ..intimate your followers to "give till you bleed".

 

Those of us that gone through the educational path, cannot but regret.

If I start a congregation... each member gives the church a minimum of $100 monthly..... don't give, "you don't love God"..

Multiply by a modest 100 followers, the monthly collection exceeds $100000....no bad at all..

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Hello people, what is your problem???? The Oceanfront $10 million penthouse is not fully Kong Hee's. It is con-owned with Indonesian tycoon Wahju Hanafi. The monthly instalment is a very very modest sum of $17,000. Surely Kong Hee is capable of spending such small sum of money. We all know his wife is internationally renowned and he is CHC #1. They both live a very hectic life and they deserve a good night rest and a place truly called home. Dont you all agree with me? Oceanfront is the perfect haven for this beautiful and successful couple. They deserve our blessing!

Come!!! let us all applaud and wish he could fully own this $10 million home! May he and Sun have bigger homes to own in the future.

You can go and sell your mom's vagina to save your "savior" for all I care. Wake up lah for God's sake. So many churches out there you can go to. Why follow a lost cause?

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Sun-Ho-City-Harvest-plastic-surgery.jpg

Sun-Ho-recent-image.jpgHo-Yeow-Sun-Kong-Hee-City-Harvest-plastiSun-Ho-pop-star-City-Harvest-plastic-surSun-Ho-and-Kong-Hee.jpg

 

It is great how modern photography can capture and preserve forever the happy moments of this amazing couple.

 

Hopefully they allow him to keep copies of them in his jail cell, and eventually later in her jail cell, so they can have remembrance of what they have lived.  One saying in Spanish goes like "who can take away that what they have danced?"

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Seems like in other countries especially USA have many of such mega churches too.

 

I am curious, did the city harvest do any charity work?

 

Yes, these church leaders were charitable towards each other.

 

There are many naive people in the USA too.  More among 300 million people than among 5 million people.

But why does Singapore need to copy the BAD from the USA?

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The devil in me ..

 

Those of us that gone through the educational path, cannot but regret.

If I start a congregation... each member gives the church a minimum of $100 monthly..... don't give, "you don't love God"..

Multiply by a modest 100 followers, the monthly collection exceeds $100000....no bad at all..

 

I believe that your total has one zero too many.  But $10,000 / month is still good money, just not great.  This lower amount will give you motivation to increase membership to 1000 and beyond.  

 

We all have different motivations to pursue advance education.  But if your goal is to put all your being into increasing the number of fools and suckers that fall for your nonsense and enjoy your raising greed for all the money under your control which you cannot eat up,  then you can regret any advance education.

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While the project crossover is debatable, his luxurious lifestyle is not.

鍾意就好,理佢男定女

 

never argue with the guests. let them bark all they want.

 

结缘不结

不解缘

 

After I have said what I wanna say, I don't care what you say.

 

看穿不说穿

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Guest secrets

It seems like this church has mainly local members, heard from a friend that her boss and big shots in the company are also members. I'm thinking there is more than there is that meets the eye than being a mere religious group. if they can embezzle money from the members they might have other secrets.

Heard from a straight friend that many youths mainly join to get to know the opposite sex and also to get to know rich people. It is a rich organisation, that's why it is so big and popular.

I doubt any from the LGBT are in it since christians are homophobic. Probably only the closeted ones or those who are forced by parents.

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It seems like this church has mainly local members, heard from a friend that her boss and big shots in the company are also members. I'm thinking there is more than there is that meets the eye than being a mere religious group. if they can embezzle money from the members they might have other secrets.

Heard from a straight friend that many youths mainly join to get to know the opposite sex and also to get to know rich people. It is a rich organisation, that's why it is so big and popular.

I doubt any from the LGBT are in it since christians are homophobic. Probably only the closeted ones or those who are forced by parents.

 

I wonder if those big bosses and big shots were also stupid enough to donate 10% of their salary to CHC. Or perhaps they were using the same emotional blackmail to pressurize the weaker ones into putting in 10%, while the stronger ones gets away with lying about their "10%" donation which never amounted into that.

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I wonder if those big bosses and big shots were also stupid enough to donate 10% of their salary to CHC. Or perhaps they were using the same emotional blackmail to pressurize the weaker ones into putting in 10%, while the stronger ones gets away with lying about their "10%" donation which never amounted into that.

 

It's so easy to speculate about their wrongdoings.

And it's so easy for the speculations to be true.

 

 

One comment in the link: "Let us prey".

LOL

 

"Let us prey"... LOL!  God heard their pray, and since they are their favorite children, he conceded.

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Multi-platinum and Billboard-charting Asian pop diva SUN aka Geisha is a Singapore-born counsellor who exploded onto the international music scene just over 5 years ago. Every Mandarin pop album she has released has achieved multi-platinum sales throughout Asia, each album outperforming the previous one. SUN has performed to sold-out stadiums in Hong Kong, Taiwan, China, Singapore and Australia to as many as 20,000 people a night, and was awarded everything from the MTV Asia Award to the Hong Kong Metro Music Award. In 2003, SUN broke into Hollywood with David Foster and Peter Rafelson producing her first dance hit "Where Did Love Go". This was followed by another four back-to-back dance and rhythm singles, "One With You", "Without Love", "Ends of the Earth" and "Gone", all of which hit the top of the Billboard Dance Club Chart and the UK's Music Week Dance Chart in recent years. During this period, she consolidated her position in the music industry by working with a number of prominent musicians such as Jimmy Harry, Diane Warren, Tony Moran, Chris Cox, Eric Kupper, Jason Nevins, Moto Blanco and the Underdogs. Back in Asia, having worked with top composers such as Ma Yufen, the late Ma Zhaojun, FIR, Milk, Arys Chien, Lee Wei Song and Tan Han Jin, she was announced as the top-selling music artiste of Taiwan in 2007 and was crowned the official music ambassador of the 2008 Beijing Summer Olympic Games. SUN has her own high-end fashion apparel international distribution network, based in Singapore for the Asian market, and is currently based in Los Angeles, shuttling frequently between the US and Asia. With her latest hit single, "China Wine" (feat. Wyclef Jean, Tony Matterhorn and Elephant Man), she attempts to reach listeners internationally. SUN has since performed the 2007 Shanghai Special Olympics Theme Song with Chinese singer Sun Nan, and made an appearance at the Europe Music Awards at Berlin with Clef in November 2007.


SUN debuts her first international music video "China Wine", adopting her first alter-ego The Geisha! It features Wyclef Jean (of Shakira's "Hips Don't Lie"), Tony Matterhorn ("Dutty Wine") & Elephant Man ("Pon di River, Pon di Bank"). Directed by internationally-renowned director Wayne Isham (of Ricky Martin's "She Bangs"), the music video also co-stars top international supermodel Tyson Beckford ("Zoolander", "Into the Blue"). SUN is dressed in specially-tailored costumes by Christian Audigier of Ed Hardy fame.


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  • G_M changed the title to City Harvest Church Discussion - Kong Hee & Sun Ho (Compiled)
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