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What if Singapore didn't get separated from Malaysia?


Guest Leo

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Singapore would likely be the first federal territory in order to stop the racial conflict from worsening. 1969 riots would have been worse and even more pronounced in Singapore. An emergency could also be called, so it would also have not prevented the constitutional amendment to downgrade Singapore, Sabah and Sarawak to states of Malaysia instead of equal partners with Malaya. Or perhaps Singapore would have ceased to exist as a state and merged with Kuala Lumpur, and eventually Putrajaya and Labuan, to form the Federal Territories. So Singapore postal addresses would end with "Singapura, Wilayah Persekutuan"

 

On the other hand, Singapore would remain as the commercial hub of Malaysia and the most expensive place. MNCs would place their Malaysia HQ in Singapore and a smaller version in Kuala Lumpur to handle any government relations. People in other states will still say Singapore has the worst food but won't be verbally bullying like now when Singapore is a separate country. There will sadly be no 'city state' comparison to Hong Kong, so HK would be the example to use for small sovereign states.

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On 8/28/2021 at 1:27 AM, danvin said:

The previleged group will no longer be the majority . There is no need for the GRC and ethnic quota for HDB flats.

Instead, got racial clusterfuck politics like Malaysia is going through right now.

 

No thanks. Our system not perfect but better than the neighbour up north

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On 8/28/2021 at 1:14 AM, Guest guest said:

Singapore would likely be the first federal territory in order to stop the racial conflict from worsening. 1969 riots would have been worse and even more pronounced in Singapore. An emergency could also be called, so it would also have not prevented the constitutional amendment to downgrade Singapore, Sabah and Sarawak to states of Malaysia instead of equal partners with Malaya. Or perhaps Singapore would have ceased to exist as a state and merged with Kuala Lumpur, and eventually Putrajaya and Labuan, to form the Federal Territories. So Singapore postal addresses would end with "Singapura, Wilayah Persekutuan"

 

On the other hand, Singapore would remain as the commercial hub of Malaysia and the most expensive place. MNCs would place their Malaysia HQ in Singapore and a smaller version in Kuala Lumpur to handle any government relations. People in other states will still say Singapore has the worst food but won't be verbally bullying like now when Singapore is a separate country. There will sadly be no 'city state' comparison to Hong Kong, so HK would be the example to use for small sovereign states.

HK got China support,  SG got India support,  so OK la.... 

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  • 3 months later...

I think most Singaporeans may wish for a Johor-Sg state to be under the current Spore government with current prosperity, more land and human resources.

For that to have happened, these must taken place:

- When Raffles came and 'leased' Spore from the Johor Sultan, he could have carved out more land from Johor state into the lease, or better still, take over the entire Johor state.  The straits settlement would comprise Johor-Spore. Then likely today, when kicked out as a state, we would have the Republic of Johor.  That lease agreement by Raffles sets the foundation of how Spore would be split out from the Federal of Malaya.

- When LKY took over 'Spore', he must have, in his life time, settle the racial issues before big time foreign investment can take place.  Take note that it was 'easier' to manage small Spore (even that had taken time till the early 90s for significant results), not to mention a bigger combined state with more racial issues. With no racial peace, we would not have prospered in the 70s- 80s.

 

 

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Guest Relag lah bodoh

Life in Malaysia actually quite good. Lower stress levels. Food galore. Condo, car very cheap.

 

Many places in KL to cruise.

 

If Spore was part of Malaysia, we won't have so many Malaysians flooding Spore.

 

Spore is so limited and limiting in many ways, yet so many foreigners want to come here compete for scraps.

 

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On 12/14/2021 at 8:58 PM, Guest Relag lah bodoh said:

Life in Malaysia actually quite good. Lower stress levels. Food galore. Condo, car very cheap.

 

Many places in KL to cruise.

 

If Spore was part of Malaysia, we won't have so many Malaysians flooding Spore.

 

Spore is so limited and limiting in many ways, yet so many foreigners want to come here compete for scraps.

 

 

As a current Sporean, looking from the Spore's perspective, things are cheap.  If you are a current Msian earning locally, you will not think that things are cheap.

 

Spore may be limiting in many ways, but for foreigners to flock in, that means that there is money to be earned (for them). And I understand from my foreigner PMET friends, except for the status of being a Sporean, they find it easy to compete with Sporeans.

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Guest Relag lah
On 12/15/2021 at 10:05 AM, Guest guest said:

 

As a current Sporean, looking from the Spore's perspective, things are cheap.  If you are a current Msian earning locally, you will not think that things are cheap.

 

Spore may be limiting in many ways, but for foreigners to flock in, that means that there is money to be earned (for them). And I understand from my foreigner PMET friends, except for the status of being a Sporean, they find it easy to compete with Sporeans.

As a current Sporean, looking with my eyes wide open, employers want to hire the cheapest they can find. They always have, even like 20 years ago. If they don't have to pay high or pay cpf, they'll hire. Why? Employers will tell you operating cots and rental are high ie expensive. The only people they can reduce cost is on employees. 

 

Things are cheap? A 3 room resale flat goes for $400k ++. You can buy condo in posh KL area with that amount and even save some $$.

 

The only foreignrs that flood Spore are the ones from poorer countries (sorry guys but it's true). Because of exchange rate and son on. Even the affluent are moving to China.

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Guest Kulala Lampor

Last time I worked in KL, Malaysia before. Many public holidays one. Tengku's birthday hoilday, Sulran's birthday holiday. Wah shiok, go makan and go Chin Woo pool, KL's SCC.

 

Or take train to Dang Wangi, shop posh areas.

 

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On 12/15/2021 at 12:54 PM, Guest Relag lah said:

As a current Sporean, looking with my eyes wide open, employers want to hire the cheapest they can find. They always have, even like 20 years ago. If they don't have to pay high or pay cpf, they'll hire. Why? Employers will tell you operating cots and rental are high ie expensive. The only people they can reduce cost is on employees. 

 

Things are cheap? A 3 room resale flat goes for $400k ++. You can buy condo in posh KL area with that amount and even save some $$.

 

The only foreignrs that flood Spore are the ones from poorer countries (sorry guys but it's true). Because of exchange rate and son on. Even the affluent are moving to China.

 

This myth that foreigners are flooding Singapore. Since Covid number of foreigners is shrinking in Singapore.

 

A.

The biggest group of non manual workers/ employees in Singapore currently are from Mainland China.

The number three is Japan.

 

I don't think Japanese are here from a poor country. From the numbers released you can say the Japanese should be around 15 - 20%.
The British won't be from "poor country" also, same as the rest of all other North Americans or Europeans.

 

What you always forget is that Singapore lacks certain IT related employees and those with technical skills.

 

Excerpt from a June 2021 ST article:

"As every sector seeks to be digitally enabled, their need for tech talent has grown significantly," he said, emphasising that Singapore currently does not have enough locals to fill the jobs available. In the infocomm sector alone, 6,000 jobs remain unfilled.

 

And this is not the only industry where there is lack of local workforce to fill the jobs.

 

Do you want to change the bed sheets at a hotel in Singapore on your own?

 

B.

Data from MOM:

 

Singaporeans in the workforce are at 2 million (exclusive of PRs) , MOM Data June 2021: 2,397,800 (inclusive of PRs)

Foreign workforce numbers

 
Pass type Dec 2016   Dec 2017   Dec 2018   Dec 2019   Dec 2020   Jun 2021
Employment Pass (EP) 192,300 187,700  185,800 193,700   177,100   166,900
S Pass 179,700 184,400  195,500 >200,000   174,000    164,200
Work Permit (Total) 992,700 965,200  972,600 999,000   848,200   834,300
  • Work Permit (MDW)
239,700 246,800  253,800 261,800  247,400  245,600
  • Work Permit (CMP sectors)
407,500 360,700 355,700 370,100  311,000   304,200
Other work passes2 28,300 30,700  32,100 34,700   32,200    31,700

 

Total foreign workforce
(excluding MDWs and Work Permits in CMP sectors)
745,700  760,600  776,500  795,500   673,100  647,400

 

FOOTNOTE

2. “Other work passes” includes Letter of Consent (LOC), pre-approved LOC, Training Work Permit (TWP) and Training Employment Pass (TEP).

 

 

C. Straits Times article from Jul 8, 2021:

 

The top nationalities that comprise around two-thirds of Singapore's EP holders have been consistent since 2005 - namely, those from China, India, Japan, Malaysia, the Philippines and Britain.

The proportion of Employment Pass (EP) holders from India is at to 25 per cent in 2020.

 

210707-by-the-numbers-online.jpg

 

 

 

There is a decline of 100,000 in the foreign workforce from 2020 to June 2021 (Numbers for total year 2021 will only released next year).

 

The local workforce is shrinking due to a decline in local population.

 

If you want job growth and GDP growth for Singapore you just have to accept that Singapore requires such employees from certain countries.

If you want tech companies to set up in Singapore you need the influx of such specialised employees to fill the jobs.

Otherwise you are saying that you don't want any growth for Singapore and accept when foreign companies shift to other countries.

 

Also note that many jobs in Singapore are in danger of more developing and technically upgrading countries such as Eastern Europe. Manufacturing has been shifting to Vietnam.

 

And you have to consider that Singaporeans don't take up jobs in certain sectors (retail, hospitality, nurse, front desk etc).

 

The set up of foreign investments into Singapore bring jobs and retain jobs for locals.

 

 

You have to know what you want.

 

 

 

Edited by singalion
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Guest Relag lah
On 12/15/2021 at 1:52 PM, singalion said:

 

 

 

This myth that foreigners are flooding Singapore. Since Covid number of foreigners is shrinking in Singapore.

 

The biggest group of non manual workers/ employees in Singapore currently are from Mainland China.

The number three is Japan.

 

I don't think Japanese are here from a poor country. From the numbers released you can say the Japanese should be around 15 - 20%.
The British won't be from "poor country" also, same as the rest of all other North Americans or Europeans.

 

 

Think we both know the Japs, English Americans and other white skin are here to start companies and hire people. You very seldom see them as employees. There might be a few in Japanes storese, but they are minority.

 

Yes I know we need people to do the jobs Sporeans don't want to do. Sometimes I am sad because Sporeans have become so snobbish and shun menial jobs. Other countries, the locals do the menial jobs. Yes there may be instances of foreigners doing menial work but I don't think it's as serious as Spore.

 

I think the main driver for foreigners is

1) Money. Most foreign employyess are cheaper. If I am an employer, I will also do the same.

2) Also Singaporeans all want to aim high in terms of position and pay. So you have many leaders and few followers.

3) 20 years ago, my female classmates sneered at jobs like store cashiers, private school teachers, etc. So you get the idea how bad the situation is even then. People should not be mocked because they do menial work isn't it? But the school principal, VP and HODs, lots of female teachers will laugh at you for doing maintenance,  getting school attendants to do stuff. So childish. Even more childish than the children they teach. Think the whole snob thing starts from schools.

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On 12/15/2021 at 2:12 PM, Guest Relag lah said:

Think we both know the Japs, English Americans and other white skin are here to start companies and hire people. You very seldom see them as employees. There might be a few in Japanes storese, but they are minority.

 

Yes I know we need people to do the jobs Sporeans don't want to do. Sometimes I am sad because Sporeans have become so snobbish and shun menial jobs. Other countries, the locals do the menial jobs. Yes there may be instances of foreigners doing menial work but I don't think it's as serious as Spore.

 

I think the main driver for foreigners is

1) Money. Most foreign employyess are cheaper. If I am an employer, I will also do the same.

2) Also Singaporeans all want to aim high in terms of position and pay. So you have many leaders and few followers.

3) 20 years ago, my female classmates sneered at jobs like store cashiers, private school teachers, etc. So you get the idea how bad the situation is even then. People should not be mocked because they do menial work isn't it? But the school principal, VP and HODs, lots of female teachers will laugh at you for doing maintenance,  getting school attendants to do stuff. So childish. Even more childish than the children they teach. Think the whole snob thing starts from schools.

 

Your perspective, (unfortunately), is from the low ses' perspective.

As the economy moves up the value chain, so would the requirements for the workforce. If one cannot follow-up, then there will be a mismatch and hence, structural unemployment.

Fact is, when you look at the degree of literacy (or command of language) of sections of our workforce, I do not see how they can really compete effectively.  And I have yet to bring in more job requirements such as specialist skills, digitalisation abilities, etc.  It is like asking a generation of Toto buyers to suddenly switch to crypto trading.

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Guest Relag lah
On 12/15/2021 at 8:45 PM, Guest guest said:

 

Your perspective, (unfortunately), is from the low ses' perspective.

As the economy moves up the value chain, so would the requirements for the workforce. If one cannot follow-up, then there will be a mismatch and hence, structural unemployment.

Fact is, when you look at the degree of literacy (or command of language) of sections of our workforce, I do not see how they can really compete effectively.  And I have yet to bring in more job requirements such as specialist skills, digitalisation abilities, etc.  It is like asking a generation of Toto buyers to suddenly switch to crypto trading.

You are speaking from the employers' perspective? They'll say anything to justify their actions. Mostly disingenuous arguments.

 

They all say India, China better than Spore like it's the truth. Previously no one would hire people from there because their degrees were not recognised.

 

And you are implying that Sporeans who studied at local u, Aussie u, England U and other commonwealth Unis all cannot make it. 

 

Let's go into one area eg specialists skills. Doctors from India better than NUS? Computer Science in Spore cannot surpass India? So why are our local education system still in operation? Might as well all  go study in India.

 

But you are spot on about the sudden switch. Suddenly India is tops, NUS is only worthy of driving PHV. How fast the tables have turned.

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  • 7 months later...
Guest Mahatir
On 8/22/2021 at 1:57 PM, Guest Leo said:

What if Singapore didn't get separated from Malaysia? What would be our economy and people and freedom?

Most likely Singapore is more prosperous than what it is today. People are happy. Salary will be good. Prices are cheaper

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On 8/8/2022 at 3:39 AM, Guest Mahatir said:

Most likely Singapore is more prosperous than what it is today. People are happy. Salary will be good. Prices are cheaper

It will depends on who is the leader since 1965. We could be one of the G20 countries or remain like what our neighbour is today. 

Edited by lonelyglobe
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