Advice On Male Skin Care - Acne Product / Body Lotion / Moisturizer / Face Wash (Compiled)

[Alain T]

Hey guys, thanks again for all suggestions and advice!! appreciate it.

To "Blow" - Ya, i guest we both have the same skin problems. I dun have pimples now...but still got those "old-scars"...hehe. Think i shld pay a visit to those polyclinic one day..BB Cream/Sunblock...think i'll also get one when I'm back to Sg this week......and..totally agree on the "trial and error" things..haha...ben practicing this long time ago..on those facial products..

Actually i did use Dermalogica products...more than 3 leh last time...but ya, its kindof expensive..and...dunno, i just found some others more "effective" (well, maybe..haha)...then now i am using Vichy for months...hehe. Its good, just that still couldnt find those can really "remove/reduce scare/spot"...though with those "anti-blemish" things..hehe.

[Guest amidst_the_stars]

Hey guys, thanks again for all suggestions and advice!! appreciate it.

To "Blow" - Ya, i guest we both have the same skin problems. I dun have pimples now...but still got those "old-scars"...hehe. Think i shld pay a visit to those polyclinic one day..BB Cream/Sunblock...think i'll also get one when I'm back to Sg this week......and..totally agree on the "trial and error" things..haha...ben practicing this long time ago..on those facial products..

Actually i did use Dermalogica products...more than 3 leh last time...but ya, its kind of expensive..and...dunno, i just found some others more "effective" (well, maybe..haha)...then now i am using Vichy for months...hehe. Its good, just that still couldnt find those can really "remove/reduce scare/spot"...though with those "anti-blemish" things..hehe.

Me using Dermologica too after trying out other brands which didn't do to owell for my skin. I like Dermologica cuz its mild on my skin and it freshens up my complexion. Though from time to time i have mild breakouts like now. And I do scrub my face but nvr more den 3 times a week cuz i remembered this facial therapist's advice to never do daily scrubs as this will damage my skin.

Dermo is ex but I can make them last from 3 - 5 months for each batch. Btw acne.org seems cool.

Edited March 9, 2011 by amidst_the_stars

[Guest Guest]

If price is not an issue, u can try the legendary La Mer, which was purportedly invented by scientist Max Huber when he was scarred in a laboratory accident.

The astronomical price aside, I personally find that it is indeed a very effective product in clearing up my complexion.

[qedcwc]

I have been taught that skin beauty/perfection is always from inside-out.

Nutrition intake plays some 70% of a human body’s health.

In this case, vitamin E plays an important role for healing acne scars, due to its contribution in cell buildup and repair.

Vitamin E is mostly found in nuts, almonds, cashews, etc.

The catch is that vitamin E is a fat-soluble vitamin and one can’t possibly crunch on so many nuts in a day.

Thus, aside daily meals, I take a supplement called Lecithin E.

Lecithin is a fat carrier and is responsible for breaking down fats and cholesterols in the body.

Naturally, lecithin would be found in egg yolk (then again, one can’t afford to swallow a lot of eggs in a day).

Lecithin E definitely has helped me a lot in healing my pimple scars.

Here’s the official description of the Lecithin E:

• Flavoured with honey, carob, and maple-walnut, one chewable tablet provides 25 IU of vitamin E and 50 mg of lecithin.
  
• Vitamin E is an important antioxidant that combats free radicals.
  
• Lecithin is a fat emulsifier of fatty substances in the body and aids in the absorption of vitamin E.
  

For external application, I use Artistry Essentials Anti-Blemish Acne Treatment.

Very effective for me and heals breakouts rather fast without so much of leaving a scar behind. Pimples are also reduced within a short period, depending on the pimple size.

Official description is as follow:

• Designed for targeted acne management, the ARTISTRY essentials Anti-Blemish Acne Treatment targets existing blemishes as it discourages future breakouts with healing and purifying ingredients.
  
• Exclusive ARTISTRY Purifying Complex featuring Oregano and White Willow Bark to target the many pathways blemishes occur
  
• Purifies the skin with NUTRILITE grown Acerola Cherry Fibre to help equalise surface oil and hydration levels
  
• Salicylic Acid exfoliates as it improves texture and colour, and purges blockages and build-up
  
• Licorice soothes the skin
  
• Discourages the formation of acne breakouts
  
• Ideal for all skin types and safe for sensitive skin
  
• Non-drying and non-irritating
  

Edited March 10, 2011 by qedcwc

[Guest Guest]

if stubborn serious pimples cant be rid off, go for doc prescription cream/gel or medicine.

generally OTF products and also MLM products...are not effective. they are just providing cleaning.

[tylergoogle]

I suppose us peeps here are quite good with pampering ourselves when it comes to facial health care products. i am thinking of start using those eye roll-on cream/gel thing that they sell in guardian or watson... any recommendation? which one works? which one is value for money??

[qedcwc]

I suppose us peeps here are quite good with pampering ourselves when it comes to facial health care products. i am thinking of start using those eye roll-on cream/gel thing that they sell in guardian or watson... any recommendation? which one works? which one is value for money??

The major reason why there exists a separate product for eyes from the rest of other skincare products is becos the skin layers around the eye areas are the thinnest and most sensitive on the face and do not require products with effects that strong as used on the rest of the face. This is why one can get dark eye areas easily when not enough sleep cos the breaking of blood capillaries at those areas are more visible under the thin eye area skin layers.

I personally don't believe in using an eye skincare product with a roller. For one thing, the roller is made of a denser polymer, which would mean more weightdown on the eye skin areas. Added to that is the product content, and the gripping force from the fingers that hold the product. Effects of a roller eye product may seem immediate to some people, but going long-term, they may lose their effctiveness, bcos of this unnecessary force exerted by the roller.

Standard application of eye skincare products has always been squeezing a little from the tube onto the ring fingers and tap them gently around the eyes. The ring finger is usually the 'weakest' of all five on a hand.

Beauty is always inside-out. Make sure ur diets contain the necessary protein, carotenoids, vitamin C and fatty acids for eye health. And enough sleep too!

Edited March 11, 2011 by qedcwc

[tylergoogle]

thanks man for the reply... but what if enough sleep is not a luxury available?? what eye-bag care product do you know and recommend?

[qedcwc]

thanks man for the reply... but what if enough sleep is not a luxury available?? what eye-bag care product do you know and recommend?

Then u would have to work on your diets, like I mentioned in the previous post.

I'm currently using ARTISTRY Essentials Replenishing Eye Creme.

Here's its official description:

Progressive and long-term benefits in reducing dark under-eye circles:

• Noticeably reduces the appearance of dark under-eye circles within 24 hours.
  
• Clinical tests showed significant and continual improvement in the appearance of dark circles.
  
• 30% improvement recorded within 16 weeks of use.
  

Features and benefits:

• Purified water extract of Linseed and Licorice Extract Derivative help reduce inflammation and sooth the area around the eye.
  
• Vitamin A and Centella Asiatica (Gotu Kola 崩大碗) extract effectively regulate and strengthen skin around the eye.
  
• Artistry’s exclusive Hydrolipid Matrix provides deep hydration to regulate the appearance of fine lines.
  
• Contains Citrus Bioflavonoids from Lemon, Ruby Grapefruit and Royal Mandarin Orange from Nutrilite and Bitter Orange Flowers. Citrus Bioflavonoids strengthen capillary walls in the delicate skin around the eye – this helps prevent blood leakage that causes dark under-eye circles.
  
• Fragrance-free, ophthalmologist and allergy tested, non-comedogenic – will not clog pores and safe for contact lens users.
  

Please note that many eye skincare products only aim at reducing/improving eye bags or dark eye circles. They can never go away completely until all conditions needed for good-looking eyes are fulfilled, and that includes enough rest.

Edited March 11, 2011 by qedcwc

[xxxpartyboixxx]

Is this thing sold world wide? Gotta get hold of it and try. Irregular sleep patterns, shallow sleep and sleep deprivation has made me a human-panda with black eye rings!!! Urghhh

[qedcwc]

Is this thing sold world wide? Gotta get hold of it and try. Irregular sleep patterns, shallow sleep and sleep deprivation has made me a human-panda with black eye rings!!! Urghhh

xxxpartyboixxx, the Artistry brand is available in 55 countries around the world, including Singapore.

You may PM me if are interested.

Cheers!

[willo]

how much is this product where can we get from ? did a google on this product seems to be carried by AMWAY > is this mlm product?

Edited March 12, 2011 by willo

[qedcwc]

how much is this product where can we get from ? did a google on this product seems to be carried by AMWAY > is this mlm product?

hi willo.... u're right to point out that the product is an Amway brand.

The Artistry brand has been ard for over 40 yrs and is currently among d top 5 selling brands worldwide.

But that is not the key point, the key is that it's not only efficient, but the bckgrd of d product development and d botanical ingredients selected to go into the products are solid, and most important of all, safe to use and skin pH-compatible.

The Replenishing Eye Creme sells for S$ 30 in S'pore and can last for at least 6 months for its 15 mL content. I personally have the authorization to carry this product. Feel free to approach me for more enquiries. Cheers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIn5jqEsHfI

Edited March 12, 2011 by qedcwc

[Alain T]

Hey guys, would like to hear what brand of BB cream u are using (if u r using one).

The one that I'm currently using (korea brand) appear to be a bit sticky (oily) which not really effective especially on my oily skin.

I'm looking for those non-sticky/oily type and with more natural colour, if u know what I mean coz sometimes these creams are just too much .....

Thanks

[Guest Guest]

You should not use BB cream if you have oily, sensitive or comedogenic skin.

Most BB creams are thick in texture.

[Guest Guest]

Just wondering, is it true that we have to change our facial products every 6 months? The same way as hair products?

I have been using Clinique all these long as I tend to have oily skin, no complaints. Switching to Biotherm due to the above reason.

been using skincare pdts for men for the past 40 yrs and YES, u need to alternate. Very visible results!

[Guest Guest]

as with all shampoo, body wash, toothpaste and face products, we build up some form of resistance after prolong used.

best to change brands after using them for a period of time.

[Alain T]

try Dr.Jart* Black SPF25PA++ & BB Cream.

i find it is good at blending into your skin tone. if u are tanned, try not to use too much.

of course, all bb cream has whitening effect, but it depends how much u are blending it into your skin and how much u use.

tried and test the above bb cream with numerous people and all of them love it. and all of them have different skin tones.

Well, just bought and tried BB cream from Dr Jart from watson. Yes, its good, it won't be too oily like the previous one I used and the colour is more natural.

Any good product on Dr Jart that you guys introduce?

[Guest Guest]

i sweat easily n has oily skin....wouldnt it feel patchy and yucky if i apply BB cream? if i wipe dry my face, obviously i need to reapply bb cream right?

[Alain T]

i sweat easily n has oily skin....wouldnt it feel patchy and yucky if i apply BB cream? if i wipe dry my face, obviously i need to reapply bb cream right?

Well, think I'm having quite similar skin as you. I'm using and it still feels ok. Usually I'll apply a layer of hydrant + mattifiant after that, so it keeps my skin not too oily yet it wint be too oily.

Believe me, with the development of our facial product, I don't think the BB cream will be just simply wipe away.... PM me if you want to know more about the product I'm using, don't want to give an impression that I'm promoting some and against some product..,

Cheers

[lct]

try normaderm products for oily skin .... quite good for my slightly sensitive skin

[Guest Tweety Bird]

Hi

Any Eye Gel to recommend for puffy eyebags and fine lines?

Not too expensive ones will do pls.

Thanks.

[Guest Guest]

Hi

Any Eye Gel to recommend for puffy eyebags and fine lines?

Not too expensive ones will do pls.

Thanks.

studies show not very effect. tried bodyshop, bio=essence b4. so so. save your $ lah.

i guess a proper, good nite sleep, massage around the eye plus lots of water would be more effective.

[Guest Zeithkeith]

studies show not very effect. tried bodyshop, bio=essence b4. so so. save your $ lah.

i guess a proper, good nite sleep, massage around the eye plus lots of water would be more effective.

I agreed with u that no eye gel tat can cure or solve puffer eye... Or eye bag... good sleep is the antidote...

As for wrinkle n dark eye ring can u moisturise n also

[Guest Erotictales]

Was told before lots of water is good for general health. But don't drink too much before bedtime or the puffiness will get worse.

[Guest Tweety Bird]

Hi

I am very lazy in taking care of my face and lately I am concerned as my skin has fine lines and wrinkles.

Is there any skin regime for 40 - 45 yr old mature skin?

Can pls share what face products to use eg..moisturizer , toner ..etc?

Non - comedonegenic ones preferred as my skin is sensitive and breaks out easily.

Thanks.

[Guest boya]

Hi

I am very lazy in taking care of my face and lately I am concerned as my skin has fine lines and wrinkles.

Is there any skin regime for 40 - 45 yr old mature skin?

Can pls share what face products to use eg..moisturizer , toner ..etc?

Non - comedonegenic ones preferred as my skin is sensitive and breaks out easily.

Thanks.

No need so complicated. Best stuff for mature skin is to go shop and save and get a bottle of Borges Extra Virgin Olive oil then soak yourself head to toe with it for 30 mins. Then rinse of with only water (no soap) The oilive oil will get absorbed into your skin in 1 hours time, leaving no smell and no oily feeling. Only smooth, revitalised skin. Do this for twice a week for 1 month.

[Guest Guest]

hada labo face wash is not bad. not drying and doesnt leave a slimey feeling. it is non-frag too.

if you are over 50s, u sld use richer face cream as ageing skin needs more emollient.

[Alain T]

Hi guys,

As in the title... Anyone using BB cream for men? I heard those for men use are without whitening, more darker colour which I'm more prefer. Heard Skin79 has those exclusively for men. I'm currently using Dr Jart....

Anyone has any experience to share? Especially where can I find them in SG. I've tried those large-scale Watson and Guardian in SG but couldn't find those for men use.

[No Frills Factory Outlet]

Hi guys,

As in the title... Anyone using BB cream for men? I heard those for men use are without whitening, more darker colour which I'm more prefer. Heard Skin79 has those exclusively for men. I'm currently using Dr Jart....

Anyone has any experience to share? Especially where can I find them in SG. I've tried those large-scale Watson and Guardian in SG but couldn't find those for men use.

skin79's good. though for me, i only sell skin79's HOMME GENTLE FOAM CLEANSER + SHAVING CREAM 2-IN-1 WASH lol

[Alain T]

skin79's good. though for me, i only sell skin79's HOMME GENTLE FOAM CLEANSER + SHAVING CREAM 2-IN-1 WASH lol

You mean you sell them? Where can I find them in market though? Couldn't really find them in major Watson and Guardian.

[Guest Guest]

Anyone tries skin79 homme from Korea the gentle face wash and bb cream? Can show full ingredients list from the packaging? Does it contains artificial and animal deriavatives SLS parabens etc?

[minejastr0]

I'm currently using Dr Wu's Acnecur concealer. Its suitable for oily/combination skin. For me, I used it to treat and conceal my pimples. Though it doesn't really help much in the concealing part but it really helps in treating my acne and pimples.

[qedcwc]

Beware of Origins... and possibly Estee Lauder as well.

SOURCE:

Model Caroline Forsling sues Estee Lauder for $2 million over 'manipulated' photo in ad

By Melissa Grace, DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER

Thursday, June 2nd 2011, 5:34 PM

Swedish model Caroline Forsling is suing Estee Lauder for $2 million.

A former Sports Illustrated swimsuit model has slapped Estee Lauder with a $2 million lawsuit claiming the cosmetics behemoth used a "manipulated" image of her in an anti-aging ad campaign.

Caroline Forsling, a Swedish model who lives in New York, is demanding that the company be ordered to stop using a test shot of her face that she agreed to for a hair care product shoot earlier this year - and nothing else.

Months later, Forsling saw a photo from the shoot with her hair pulled back and before her makeup was applied in an ad for the skin care product Plantscription.

The picture was split in two, with the left side of the blue-eyed beauty's face labeled "before" and the right labeled "after" in a supposed "dramatization" of the effects of a clinical test of cream.

Adding insult to injury, the advertising materials - which were plastered on the Estee Lauder-owned Origins line website and on in-store displays - stated that the test subjects of the study were women aged 45-60, the lawsuit charges.

"Forsling has never used Plantscription. She did not participate in Defendants' study - indeed, she would not have been eligible to participate because she is significantly younger than 45," the suit claims - without indicating her age.

"Upon information and belief, the image was modified through the use of photo editing software though it remained recognizable as an image of Forsling," her lawyer, Edward Rosenthal, wrote in the legal papers filed Tuesday in Manhattan Supreme Court.

The ex-catwalk crawler's birthday is unknown but her online bio says she appeared in the 1998 Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue and graced the cover of German "Marie Clair" in January 1999.

Her lawyer did not return calls for comment.

Forsling said that despite agreeing to stop using the photo, Estee Lauder and Origins sent it to modeling agencies as "casting call materials" as they sought models with "fine wrinkles."

The suit claims Forsling's civil rights were violated and the company enriched itself at her expense and damaged her career.

Officials at Estee Lauder and Origins had no comment on the pending litigation.

[qedcwc]

SOURCE

谁说我45岁？名模怒告雅诗兰黛

（台湾） (2011-06-04)

（联合早报网讯）台湾联合新闻网报道，你说谁45岁？曾是美国“运动画刊”（Sports Illustrated）泳装模特儿，也为香奈儿（Chanel）走秀的瑞典模特儿卡洛琳-佛斯林（Caroline Forsling），去年为知名化妆品集团雅诗兰黛（Estee Lauder）护发产品试镜，照片后来却被加上满脸皱纹后当作抗老产品广告。佛斯林指控雅诗兰黛伤害她的事业及形象，提告并求偿200万美元。

　　35岁的佛斯林拍摄试镜照时并未被告知会被用在其他地方，日前在雅诗兰黛旗下品牌“品木宣言”（Plantscription）的抗皱产品广告看到自己的照片。

　　该张广告照片特写拍摄佛斯林，她的脸被分成左右两边，其中半边的脸经过修片，脸部肌肤变得黯沉、松弛还有一大堆皱纹，让消费者比较“使用前、使用后”的效果，还强调产品适用于45岁到60岁之间的女性。

　　佛斯林的律师强调，佛斯林虽是熟女，“但年龄绝对在45岁以下”，而且她从未使用过该款抗皱产品，雅诗兰黛此举简直是“毁了她的职业生涯”，除了赔偿另须立即撤下广告。

[slut]

There are no concealers designed specially for any particular sex. The purpose of a concealer is to conceal any minor flaws on the face, so practically, it is useful for both men and women. But ofcos, as mentioned, if u use only the concealer, it will result in patches without a layer of foundation.

For me, I’m currently using ARTISTRY™ Concealer SPF15 PA++ and ARTISTRY™ Ideal Dual Powder Foundation SPF18 PA+++.

Under the advice and colour-matching by the head lady consultant, she found a concealer (stick form) with a colour slightly darker than my skin tone and foundation with a slightly lighter colour. She told me, as per my own witnessing, the application of the foundation will initially make my skin tone look lighter, but as the Artistry Foundation was formulated with patented Ideal Shade Technology, the colour of the foundation will manage to adjust and blend with my original skin tone colour within a short period, which was fascinating. Even the flaws have been reduced of their visibility a lot. The result would be at least u dun look so ‘flawed’ and won’t look too ‘flawless’, unless u really take really intensive care of ur face.

Features of the Artistry Concealer:

• Exclusive ARTISTRY Ideal Shade Technology features shades that adjust to match skin tone.
  
• Protective Complexion Barrier helps neutralise free radicals to protect from environmental assaults and prevent visible signs of premature aging.
  
• Long-wearing formula resists creasing for an instant uniform finish.
  
• SPF 15 PA++ protects against exposure to UVA/UVB rays from the sun
  

Features of the Artistry Ideal Dual Powder Foundation:

• Ideal Shade Technology – “Intelligent” powder connects to your skin and adjusts to match and reflect each individual skin tone
  
• Ideal Powder Technology – 3D micro-sphere powder evens skin tone and conceals fine lines and wrinkles
  
• Aura of Protection – Invisible barrier above skin that shields against free radicals and other environmental assaults to help prevent premature aging
  
• SPF 18 PA+++ – protects against UVA/UVB rays
  
• Weightless – adheres perfectly without caking
  
• Dual function – can be applied wet or dry
  

i'm curious. how does this work exactly?

[qedcwc]

i'm curious. how does this work exactly?

You mean the Ideal Shade Technology?

Let me recount my experience.

Normally I will apply the concealer first to conceal whatever flaws I have on my face.

But the concealer will look like a patch of paint on your face, which is why you need the foundation to even it out.

Most powder foundations are created in such a way that they come in different tones so that you can choose one that is closest to your skin tone.

But usually it might come across to cause your skin look too fair, which when detectable by the naked eye, other people will know that you applied foundation, which in general, doesn't go down too well with the perception of a man, unless he's involved in some artistic performance.

The Ideal Shade Technology has been included in Artistry's Powder Foundations in such a way that upon application, after a lapse of a few minutes, it will 'adjust' to reflect your actual skin tone, whilst minimizing the visibility of facial flaws.

[slut]

some cool stuff. thanks for the recommendation

[qedcwc]

some cool stuff. thanks for the recommendation

no problem.....

More details, you may check out the ARTISTRY website

Edited June 15, 2011 by qedcwc

[Guest imseeker]

Not about cosmetics but just wanna share something...

I'm sure you guys have seen those green-coloured 85 gm sachets of Geomar Thalasso Scrub at Guardian for S$3.95 at the checkout counter? Well, curiosity got the better of me and I bought one to try.

The scrub comprised these exfoliating bits in a smooth blend of oils and I felt like I was instantly transported to some rustic spa in a traditional Italian village.

Man, I now need to look for a big tub of Geomar...

[Guest Guest]

My favourite brands are the

1) the organic pharmacy: men ultra light moisture gel; free of chemical preservatives sls parabens and against animal testing

this is probably the best moisturizer I ever used. Light texture and boost the energy on my face. Fight fatigue and won't clog pores. My face don't get oily easily compared to other brands I used. Although these are no clincal studies yet to prove the effaciency of organic and 100 percent natural products. I felt very comfortable using this gel as good as the feel of nothing on my face. also tried the peppermint cleanser, very comfortable after cleansing. 80bucks 75ml for the men's moisture gel and 70bucks 100ml for the peppermint cleanser. Also using the antioxidant gel (120bucks 30ml) in conjunction with antioxidant serum (180bucks 30ml). The antioxidant gel and serum are for nightly use before bed. Rich and oily(essential oils) good for air-con nights. Though don't see dramatic results (good night sleep is impt), but feel good and face dewy next morning. Quite costly so thinking of switching brands but will continue to use the moisture gel if there's isn't any other better ones.

2) Kyoku for men: Japanese inspired London based USA made men skincare brand. The founder was inspired during his trip to a small village outside Tokyo. Saw the elderly man at their age still maintain very good complexion thru their diet and "3 steps kirei ritual": cleanse scrub and fuel. This brand is quite a big hit in uk and USA because of it's efficient Japanese ingredients and high technology used. Just bought the eye fuel and oil control lotion. Anyone else used this brand and care to share more?

[Guest Guest]

invest in a good cleanser, a good cleanser helps to lift dirt oil pollution Prepares your skin to absorb nutrition of your skin care products. Use those low foaming low alcohol cleansers similar to skin's PH value.

Use those Asian skin focus / ingredients that are similar to our Asian skin diet. This is because our skin and organs have already "adapted" to the same type of ingredients and diet daily. Personally I also think that this help to reduce allergic and sensitivity since the body "knows" the ingredients and will react conventionally.

Try using brands that are only focusing on male skin, and not those big commercial brands that second their products to the men labels.

Anyone care to share more? Brands like menscience Jack black, urth skin solutions for men and kyoku for men any tried them before???

[Guest Needadvice]

Hello anyone uses bb creams? Does the bb cream helps to cover up pitted scars / improve the complexion like making pitted scars less deep and tighten up big pores over time?

[Shaukee]

OK.Then what MUST grooming products that should on male list?

[Asakura Hao]

I am very upset recently as i discovered that my face problem is getting worst.

Anyone has any suggestion?

[Guest Jonty]

to be born lucky

[Guest beautician]

daily cum facial treatment

[Guest imseeker]

I am very upset recently as i discovered that my face problem is getting worst.

Anyone has any suggestion?

You need to be more specific - what kind of face problem do you have?

1. acne?

2. pimples?

3. pimple scars?

4. oily skin?

5. open/visible pores?

6. wrinkles?

7. crow's feet?

8. fine lines on cheek?

9. sagging skin?

10. sunburnt skin?

[Guest Guest]

if its very bad, u really need to see a dermalogist.

I think partly due to bad genes. just pray next life u are born w good skin gene.

[Shaukee]

I am very upset recently as i discovered that my face problem is getting worst.

Anyone has any suggestion?

worse what? care to explain?